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Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

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Sportsmanship

Post by MaskedWriter on 26/02/13, 09:55 am

bigtex75081 wrote:I think the associations in NTX need to make a rule change. I think that if a player is issued a yellow card that they should be required to leave the field immediately and have a "5 minute cool-off" period. The team shouldn't be forced to play down. I'm not saying it's a red card.

This and also all tournaments should have the tie-breaker sequence as:
(1) fewest red cards accumulated
(2) fewest yellow cards accumulated
(3) goal differential (or head-to-head per the TD's preference)

There was physical play when my DD played Fever, but nothing too blatant (and don't recall parents being an issue either). There was one instance where one cleated another on the calf but not sure if it was intentional. Regardless, a foul was called and our player was able to stay in the game. Really the only team that I've had dirty play be an issues is the Lubbock Cruz Azul game. Multiple yellows were deserved, none were issued -- there was intent to injure and eliminate players from the game.

IMO, the TGPL teams are all savvy enough to be aware of what deserves a yellow and what doesn't. The coaches are betting that the refs will be loathe to issue cards and as a result they try to exploit it. Teams need to be held accountable if they elect to play soccer in this manner.

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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by Airwynn on 26/02/13, 10:07 am

While I totally support handing out cards when appropriate, there are some truly ridiculous cards that have been given. In those cases, a kid should not be forced to lose game time because the Ref is CLUELESS. The Refs amd Coaches should be teaching the girls at this age to play the game within the rules (thow-ins, HANDBALLS,, dangerous play, etc) and with integrity and good spotsmanship. Very Happy
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by Guest on 26/02/13, 10:13 am

Under BigTex's new rule, would it be the home team or visiting team manager that is responsible to bring the cardboard "box of shame" for the kid to sit in during their 5 minutes on the sideline???

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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by my2cents on 26/02/13, 10:16 am

bigtex75081 wrote:My eyes were opened concerning yellow cards during a tournament in Hurst a few months ago. During a '03G game there was a central defender that consistently committed very physical fouls. She committed so many of these fouls that, with about 8 minutes left in the game the ref was finally compelled to give the girl a yellow. It was not a yellow for a single foul, it was an "accumulation yellow" as you could see the referee point to the different spots on the field where she'd been previously warned.

What surprised me about the incident was her reaction. This 9 year-old made brief eye contact with the referee, shrugged her shoulders, and jogged back to defend the free kick. (All of this happened while the victim, the opposing team’s best offensive player, had to be carried off the field.) I was surprised at how dismissive she was of the card. It read to me like she'd already seen several yellows in her past.

As I thought about it, I started to understand her reaction. A yellow card doesn't really mean anything to her. It didn't impact the way she played the rest of the game. It didn't really do anything to negatively impact her or her team. She just stepped back and got back to business.

I imagine she was probably going to be congratulated by her coach and her parents after the game for doing such a good job in shutting down the middle of the field for the team. (Because she really had done well.) If that was the case though, that yellow card then could be viewed as more of a “badge of courage” than a discipline.

I think the associations in NTX need to make a rule change. I think that if a player is issued a yellow card that they should be required to leave the field immediately and have a "5 minute cool-off" period. The team shouldn't be forced to play down. I'm not saying it's a red card. I'm not saying she shouldn't be allowed to return. All I'm saying is… she should have been forced out of the game for a few minutes to think about what she was doing wrong and why she wasn't being allowed to play during that break. And if the coach was suddenly playing without his team’s best defender for the next 5 minutes… maybe he’d discourage the physical play a little bit more.

In a situation such as this the ref must issue a yellow card. The coach knows, or should know, what persistant infringment is and is allowing, thus condoning, it. This player obviously did not care so the lesson to be learned for the young player is that warnings on excessive fouls have teeth. Get one or 2 verbals, then a yellow, then a second yellow and you sit. It may seem that the age is too young to give cards but if this is the style and attitude of play then no, it is not too young. It is called game managment and failure to do so results in poorly played matches, injuries and out of controls players and spectators. If there is clear intent to injure then yes they should be ejected either by the coach voluntarily benching the player or the issuing of a straight red. It can be really amazing how one or two well timed cards can settle a whole game and sideline down.


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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by JewelsBMF on 26/02/13, 10:24 am

I liked the idea that was used in our indoor league. It worked just like Hockey; if a player got a yellow card (and the Refs weren't afraid to use them) the player sat on the bench for 2 mins and the offending team played down a player. Power plays in Soccer! The coach would defiantly have a word with each player that committed a yellow card infraction since he's next to him on the bench, and his team is down a player, hence not a happy coach.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by ekkeeper1 on 26/02/13, 10:41 am

Well USSF who makes the rules could implement a yellow card rule like high school has (in HS if you receive a yellow you must leave the game for a short amount of time). I actually like having that as an option a good way to get a player to calm down and avoid making a not so smart decision in the heat of the moment. Good luck getting USSF to make that rule change though.

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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by Texandad on 26/02/13, 11:26 am

ekkeeper1 wrote:Well USSF who makes the rules could implement a yellow card rule like high school has (in HS if you receive a yellow you must leave the game for a short amount of time). I actually like having that as an option a good way to get a player to calm down and avoid making a not so smart decision in the heat of the moment. Good luck getting USSF to make that rule change though.

From a prime time game report...


Cautions
C-1 Unsporting Behavior
C-2 Dissent
C-3 Persistent Infringement
C-4 Delays Restart
C-5 Fails to respect proper distance
C-6 Entering or leaving the field without
the referee’s permission
Send-offs
E-1 Serious Foul Play
E-2 Violent Conduct
E-3 Spits at opponent or person
E-4 Intentional ball handling to deny goal
E-5 Denies goal scoring opportunity
E-6 Offensive, insulting, abusive language
E-7 Receives second caution

The problem is, the officials are sub-par and do not know the rules to enforce.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by ekkeeper1 on 26/02/13, 11:31 am

I know the cardable offenses seeing as I referee, but what i was discussing in my post had to do with changing rules for yellow cards so the player leaves the game for a little bit. The same options for yellow and red cards are on just about every game report.

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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by justamomof2 on 26/02/13, 11:34 am

ekkeeper1 wrote:I know the cardable offenses seeing as I referee, but what i was discussing in my post had to do with changing rules for yellow cards so the player leaves the game for a little bit. The same options for yellow and red cards are on just about every game report.

Changing rules won't make a bit of difference if the refs won't issue cards. I wonder if they'd be even less likely knowing they were putting a team at a disadvantage by making them short for several minutes....

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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by Texandad on 26/02/13, 11:35 am

ekkeeper1 wrote:I know the cardable offenses seeing as I referee, but what i was discussing in my post had to do with changing rules for yellow cards so the player leaves the game for a little bit. The same options for yellow and red cards are on just about every game report.

Changing the rules will not do anything to help until the officials start applying the rules that are already on the books.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by ekkeeper1 on 26/02/13, 11:42 am

Wont argue that point, although i have had many fair challenges in recent games in which parents had no idea as well. Two boys went for a ball slid into ball never hit each other parents want a foul. I have no problem pulling yellows if it is necessary. I also personally want the players to play so at times when fouls occur if it does not effect the run of play I will let it play on and see what happens. Often times when I do that teams end up being more threatening anyways. But in the event the rules were being enforced like they should be, having a rule where you go out for a yellow card not a bad idea. although i dont think that would ever work at pro level since they are only allowed 3 subs.

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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by Texandad on 26/02/13, 11:45 am

ekkeeper1 wrote:Wont argue that point, although i have had many fair challenges in recent games in which parents had no idea as well. Two boys went for a ball slid into ball never hit each other parents want a foul. I have no problem pulling yellows if it is necessary. I also personally want the players to play so at times when fouls occur if it does not effect the run of play I will let it play on and see what happens. Often times when I do that teams end up being more threatening anyways. But in the event the rules were being enforced like they should be, having a rule where you go out for a yellow card not a bad idea. although i dont think that would ever work at pro level since they are only allowed 3 subs.

Parents are 99% of the problem, just look at this board! I would like to see the officials hold the parents more responsible for their actions.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by GOLDENDOMER on 26/02/13, 11:59 am

Another Cruz Azul roughed up my daughter story. Very sorry a bunch of 9 and 10 year old girls keep you up at night. Have heard it all before, same old story. But its funny that some of the worse crying foul now have there kidos playing with us. And resently just added three really good girls, who drive two hours to and from just to practice with the team. All our girls came home with bruses and scrapes also, there just use to getting back up and not flopping on the floor. As was instructed by the LP parent right in front of our parent's side of the line for the record. The two players went for the ball at the same time and the LP player went down got right back up and "MOMMY" runs up and says fall back down "NOW". Every time you go shoulder to shoulder if they can't take it from us. Hands up in the air and a flop ten feet back, it's like watching the San Antonio Spurs play. Serously no one likes to see there child fall down but there are easier sports to play. These girls have been playing up with boys teams most of there lives and are use to not giving an inch. But I am glad we have this little following online since at all the tournaments its just a bunch of high fives and great game guys. cheers
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by Texandad on 26/02/13, 12:06 pm

Like I said, the parents should be held accountable for their sideline behavior. Anyone looking for yellow or red cards on this board are the same parents that probably have sideline behavior that warrants them to be sent to the car. Stop complaining about physical play, stop complaining about missed calls, and start encouraging you kid and the team she plays for.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by my2cents on 26/02/13, 12:53 pm

Texandad wrote:Like I said, the parents should be held accountable for their sideline behavior. Anyone looking for yellow or red cards on this board are the same parents that probably have sideline behavior that warrants them to be sent to the car. Stop complaining about physical play, stop complaining about missed calls, and start encouraging you kid and the team she plays for.

Or maybe, just maybe, they are parents with older kids that have seen more concussions, stitches, blown out ankles, destroyed knees and broken legs than they care to count.
Maybe, just maybe, they know that the card system is there to facilitate game managment and protect players from undue injury. Soccer is a physical sport with inherent risks. Serious injury because of foul play should not be one of them.
May, just maybe, they know that giving, or recieving a yellow card is no big deal. It is just what it is, a caution. If at U9 or older a red card offense is committed that is a good age to tell the player in no uncertain terms that behavior such as that will not be tolerated.

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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by free4all on 26/02/13, 12:57 pm

Having read the last several posts...there are so many things to reply to.

There is contact (Good aggressive play...but... A foul is a foul. Even if unintentional. Unintentional fouls draw the call. Intentional fouls demand a card (yellow). Intentional injury demands ejection (the red). Retalliation is always a red.
I agree getting the call is tough. Refs are watching 22 players, not to mention coaches and fans.
As a coach (not in this age group) when I have approached refs about calling the fouls the response most often is- "I did not think that was intentional". Well, it is still a foul. Had it been intentional there are above mentioned consequences.

As for changing rules- that is excedingly difficult. Many leagues follow FIFA code and will make changes when FIFA makes changes. It is easier to change things that don't affect the "rules of the game". ie: fines.
They may already be in place in many leagues, but significant fines to coaches/clubs will likely help. If I had to pay because of a players bad chioce...I would pass that on either financially to the family or with decreased PT next outting.


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Diversion

Post by MaskedWriter on 26/02/13, 01:01 pm

GOLDENDOMER wrote:Another Cruz Azul roughed up my daughter story. Very sorry a bunch of 9 and 10 year old girls keep you up at night. Have heard it all before, same old story. But its funny that some of the worse crying foul now have there kidos playing with us. And resently just added three really good girls, who drive two hours to and from just to practice with the team. All our girls came home with bruses and scrapes also, there just use to getting back up and not flopping on the floor. As was instructed by the LP parent right in front of our parent's side of the line for the record. The two players went for the ball at the same time and the LP player went down got right back up and "MOMMY" runs up and says fall back down "NOW". Every time you go shoulder to shoulder if they can't take it from us. Hands up in the air and a flop ten feet back, it's like watching the San Antonio Spurs play. Serously no one likes to see there child fall down but there are easier sports to play. These girls have been playing up with boys teams most of there lives and are use to not giving an inch. But I am glad we have this little following online since at all the tournaments its just a bunch of high fives and great game guys. cheers

Ignore that man behind the curtain!

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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by Guest on 26/02/13, 01:03 pm

I agree getting the call is tough. Refs are watching 22 players, not to mention coaches and fans.
As a coach (not in this age group) when I have approached refs about calling the fouls the response most often is- "I did not think that was intentional". Well, it is still a foul. Had it been intentional there are above mentioned consequences.

This is a different can of worms, with kids you could stop the game 100 times for unintentional fouls. Unless it is important, i say let them play...

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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by GOLDENDOMER on 26/02/13, 01:51 pm

Say's the little man with the stage name "maskedwriter". let me apologize for all players who have actaully played competitive sports and don't live there lives through a ten year old little girl. I'm sorry your books were dropped and you were stuffed in a locker all through high school.It's time to put on your big girl panties and get over it.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by GOLDENDOMER on 26/02/13, 01:56 pm

"Silentparent" need I say more. I bet you and maskedwriter sit in the living room together all day just wishing you could have got in for one play. Some people were ment to ride the bench and others were meant to compete.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by Texandad on 26/02/13, 02:14 pm

GOLDENDOMER wrote:Say's the little man with the stage name "maskedwriter". let me apologize for all players who have actaully played competitive sports and don't live there lives through a ten year old little girl. I'm sorry your books were dropped and you were stuffed in a locker all through high school.It's time to put on your big girl panties and get over it.

Pipe down, big boy. Your daughters team won 2 games in the tournament and tied the #18 team according to these rankings. Really not a very big showing. But from the way you speak, it dounds like you were out there playing the game. Maybe you should chime back in when your daughters team beats a quality team. I am sure the other people that post on this board will put this conversation on hold until such time. Nomatterhow long it takes.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by jj4mel on 26/02/13, 02:23 pm

Maybe Goldendomer needs to just consider the term refrain and follow his club's guidelines. I think coach Barrera would be embarassed to know one of his parents were on this forum and unable to refrain from the jabs.

Expected Behavior:

By Parents:


1.'Positive encouragement is good; negative comments are bad.'
2.'Cheering is good, but do not yell at your child or anyone else's child during the game. It can be distracting & what you tell them may be different from what the coach is saying.
3.'Be careful not to say anything that might be taken the wrong way or hurt someone's feelings. Remember: this is for fun & these are children.'
4.'Be a good role model & a good sport.'
5.'Do not yell at the referees or say anything bad to or about the other team. Never boo the other team or cheer when they make a mistake.'
6.'Please 'DO NOT' coach the team, or your child during a game.'

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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by GOLDENDOMER on 26/02/13, 02:59 pm

Everyone knows these rankings are as legit as the paper there written on. And the little texans sounds like he can give but can't take. I'm sure one of those teams was probley yours. Sounds like you probley were that parent that ran from goal post to goal post and almost got your coach kicked out of the game. Can guarantee you never say any of our parents cross that invisible line or cuss out an old man. And tell me texan was that the name of your last team before you pumped ship. Don't remember seeing any Dallas texan teams there.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by SolarPower00 on 26/02/13, 03:10 pm

enuffsoccer wrote:Solar Blue loses to Lubbock Cruz Azul in Finals 1-4. Solar Blue beat Sting Scarfone 04s 4-1 and Solar Armstrong 5-0, but loses both rugby/MMA matches against Lubbock. Lubbock was huge and dangerously physical (full speed body checks and flying legs) and their coach had the shameless gall to call girls floppers when fouls were called.

This post was from a Flamefest 03 thread eight months ago.
Some things never change.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by Texandad on 26/02/13, 03:16 pm

GOLDENDOMER wrote:Everyone knows these rankings are as legit as the paper there written on. And the little texans sounds like he can give but can't take. I'm sure one of those teams was probley yours. Sounds like you probley were that parent that ran from goal post to goal post and almost got your coach kicked out of the game. Can guarantee you never say any of our parents cross that invisible line or cuss out an old man. And tell me texan was that the name of your last team before you pumped ship. Don't remember seeing any Dallas texan teams there.

No sir. I don't play on a team, my daughter does. You will have to look a lot higher in the rankings than 18 to find the team she plays on. Nice try, though. Never said I was there at the tournament. I even was on your side as these other posters were all over your team for rough play. I have never seen the team your kid plays on. Don't really care. My kid has been a Texan since she joined the academy years ago. Like someone suggested to you last week, don't tarnish your daughters teams play by spewing venom on this site. I am sure her coach would be proud of you. You are keeping with his code of conduct by posting on this site.
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Re: Any sportsmanship on Fever Black?

Post by GOLDENDOMER on 26/02/13, 03:22 pm

All these comments and you weren't even there enough said.Some people just have way to much time on there hands. Don't believe you could even spell code of conduct without looking.
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