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00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

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00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by thepitch00 on 10/10/16, 10:24 am

Officiating in 00 Dfeeter's game yesterday beyond ugly!
LH should be ashamed of this ref. let the players get hurt by ignoring obvious fouls.

End of game turned his head when a PK should have been called!

Shame on LH in this instance.



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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by DallasMessi on 10/10/16, 03:22 pm

Refs are not responsible for players actions.  Period.

A good referee might pick up on a chippy game and attempt to get players to focus on the playing the game by calling picky fouls. But not every referee at lake highlands is a top notch referee.

I agree that the referee could be better - there definitely seems to be a lack in teaching and guidance from assessors at these games.

Regardless, as parents, our jobs are to ensure our daughters play within the rules of the game and play fair.

I think it's easy for parents to blame the referees, but how many parents have advised their daughters to play within the rules and not submit to serious foul play?

In the end, it's the player's choice. And players are generally a shadow of their parents.

And how many parents have read the rule book and signed up for a referee class?

My 2 cents.
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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by SickofStupidity on 10/10/16, 04:14 pm

DallasMessi wrote:Refs are not responsible for players actions.  Period.

A good referee might pick up on a chippy game and attempt to get players to focus on the playing the game by calling picky fouls. But not every referee at lake highlands is a top notch referee.  

I agree that the referee could be better - there definitely seems to be a lack in teaching and guidance from assessors at these games.

Regardless, as parents, our jobs are to ensure our daughters play within the rules of the game and play fair.

I think it's easy for parents to blame the referees, but how many parents have advised their daughters to play within the rules and not submit to serious foul play?


In the end, it's the player's choice. And players are generally a shadow of their parents.

And how many parents have read the rule book and signed up for a referee class?

My 2 cents.


Players were hurt and obvious fouls were ignored . . .

because you didn't advise your daughter to play within the rules and not submit to serious foul play

after all, it's the players choice

and they are a shadow of their parents

So ultimately - you want to know why your daughter was mauled and regularly fouled?  

Look in the mirror. Shocked


Seriously, I think thepitch was complaining about why his daughter and her teammates were assaulted during the game - not sure that talking to his daughter about the "rules of the game and fair play" would have impacted that.

If the referee refuses to control the game, maybe the better advice is "fight fire with fire"

Thugs and bullies usually don't respond well to the same tactics being used on them

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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by SickofStupidity on 10/10/16, 04:23 pm

DallasMessi wrote:Refs are not responsible for players actions.  Period.

A good referee might pick up on a chippy game and attempt to get players to focus on the playing the game by calling picky fouls. But not every referee at lake highlands is a top notch referee.  

I agree that the referee could be better - there definitely seems to be a lack in teaching and guidance from assessors at these games.

Regardless, as parents, our jobs are to ensure our daughters play within the rules of the game and play fair.

I think it's easy for parents to blame the referees, but how many parents have advised their daughters to play within the rules and not submit to serious foul play?

In the end, it's the player's choice. And players are generally a shadow of their parents.

And how many parents have read the rule book and signed up for a referee class?

My 2 cents.


Yes.  Apparently, calling obvious fouls is asking too much. Rolling Eyes

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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by DallasMessi on 10/10/16, 04:38 pm

Coaches can file reports with the league if the referee was sub par.

Players are still responsible for their actions.
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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by thepitch00 on 10/10/16, 04:46 pm

Not calling the girl's thugs at all but I do think the ref. should have called the obvious calls and should keep the game from getting players hurt.




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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by FC1 on 10/10/16, 07:43 pm

I agree the refs could be a lot better. But I also assume we as parents have ran off a ton of good refs by yelling at them from the sidelines about this or that. Not an excuse at all, but I would think it factors into the equation.

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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by nolanryan on 11/10/16, 05:21 pm

I have long been an advocate for better officiating in the local leagues.  My daughter plays in the 01 group in LH and so far we haven't had too many issues other than a couple of phantom fouls that were puzzling when called.  Comparing LH to PPL, it seems like the better referees are in LH, however, per the Pitch, there are still some that need their vision corrected.

Nothing I will ever see will likely match the neglect I saw 3 years ago in Plano when my daughter's team mate was maimed and nearly crippled by the opposing player (retaliation because the thug was getting outplayed).  It happened in front of the referee who asked that the unconscious player that was laying by the sideline be moved off the pitch so the game could continue.  Having seen the success of her crime, the thug player then flattened our goalie on a corner kick giving her a concussion.  

Letters (and video) to PPL, NTX, etc from the coach, manager  and player's parents went unanswered. To put it mildly, it was abominable.
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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by ONLYASOCCERDAD on 11/10/16, 06:36 pm

thepitch00 wrote:Officiating in 00 Dfeeter's game yesterday beyond ugly!
LH should be ashamed  of this ref. let the players get hurt by ignoring obvious fouls.

End of game turned his head when a  PK should  have been called!

Shame on LH in this instance.



ashamed? does your team deserve the best volunteer refs available? maybe you could add some class to the referees pool. some of the goods refs get run off by overbearing parents like you. i wasn't there. could have been horrible as you say. ashamed? hilarious!!! maybe more complaints will relegate this particular ref to games that fit his/her abilities.

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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by helvetii on 17/10/16, 04:07 pm

Sorry just saw the date of the original post. Disregard.


Last edited by helvetii on 17/10/16, 05:25 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by helvetii on 17/10/16, 04:42 pm



DallasMessi wrote:Coaches can file reports with the league if the referee was sub par.

Players are still responsible for their actions.

Philosophically you are correct, players are responsible for there own actions but you are over simplifying the issue. You should say that players are responsible for their own actions, and are held accountable by competent authority.

This is one of the many life lessons that competitive sports teaches our daughters,
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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by upper95 on 17/10/16, 07:54 pm

Yes there are far too many games for the very good to excellent to elite referees to cover.

That being said, most parents watch the game from a different perspective and do not know the Laws of the Game and how the referees are taught to apply them.  They do not understand that if a player falls, it does not necessarily mean she was fouled.  They do not understand that because they ball watch, generally, and look up to see the ball reach a player in an offside position, they don't know whether the player was onside when the ball was kicked.  The y don't understand that a referee is to generally ignore non-egregious fouls that do not materially affect the play.  They scream for a whistle while the referee looks for an advantage to develop, and then when it doesn't the other half of parents claim ref is listening to other team.  They don't understand that a ball touching a hand or arm is not necessarily a foul.  They think legally using a shoulder to move a player off of a ball is "pushing"

Overheard the parents of a team at a tournament complaining that the MLS referee in the middle was the worst ref they had ever seen.  They couldn't be more wrong.  What was really interesting is that their team was ECNL.

I strongly urge anyone critical of the referees to watch a game with one.  If you really think a referee is sub par, note that the coaches have standing to write complaints to the league.  If a complaint is warranted, be very specific.

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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by wittymgr on 18/10/16, 08:34 am

I nominate this for the best post ever on referee complaints. Bravo upper95.

upper95 wrote:Yes there are far too many games for the very good to excellent to elite referees to cover.

That being said, most parents watch the game from a different perspective and do not know the Laws of the Game and how the referees are taught to apply them.  They do not understand that if a player falls, it does not necessarily mean she was fouled.  They do not understand that because they ball watch, generally, and look up to see the ball reach a player in an offside position, they don't know whether the player was onside when the ball was kicked.  The y don't understand that a referee is to generally ignore non-egregious fouls that do not materially affect the play.  They scream for a whistle while the referee looks for an advantage to develop, and then when it doesn't the other half of parents claim ref is listening to other team.  They don't understand that a ball touching a hand or arm is not necessarily a foul.  They think legally using a shoulder to move a player off of a ball is "pushing"

Overheard the parents of a team at a tournament complaining that the MLS referee in the middle was the worst ref they had ever seen.  They couldn't be more wrong.  What was really interesting is that their team was ECNL.

I strongly urge anyone critical of the referees to watch a game with one.  If you really think a referee is sub par, note that the coaches have standing to write complaints to the league.  If a complaint is warranted, be very specific.
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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by textigerfan on 18/10/16, 08:51 am

It was a nice post.  People wonder why there are not enough officials in sports.  Well, maybe the parents, coaches, and at times players are the primary problem.  Most people do not have the skin to handle it.  The only place officials make very good money are in professional sports.  For everyone else, not their primary income.  Now, if people want to change that and have all sports officials be dedicated 100% to their sport, then pay up.  Till then, I suggest take a step back and evaluate if you want to take over that particular game being played.  If not, be quiet and enjoy it as much as you can. Awfully easy to bitch and moan from the sideline isn't it. I know I have been guilty of that as well.
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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by Coach on 18/10/16, 10:52 am

I am a glutton for punishment.
I ref recreation games for a local association.

The parents are the problem.
And the parent Coaches are not far behind.
The kids just want to play.
I talk to them during the game and let them know why it wasn't a foul.
I just don't have time to go explain it to the sidelines.
So they get the Ask, Tell , Dismiss rule.

My daughter refs u5 and u6 at the same complex.
I watched her last week and wanted so bad to walk out to the middle, blow my whistle as loud as humanly possible, and scream "THEY ARE 5 YEARS OLD !!! STOP YELLING AT THEM LIKE THAT !!! THEY ARE BARELY COORDINATED ENOUGH TO RUN WITHOUT FALLING, MUCH LESS DO A DOUBLE STEP OVER AND FIND THE UPPER 90 FROM 20 YARDS OUT !!!"

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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by hobbit on 21/10/16, 11:11 am

$10 says the person complaining about the officiating DD's team lost the game. You rarely hear people complain about officiating when their DD's team wins the game. If only the complaints (or constructive criticism) were provided regardless of the outcome maybe things would change.

On a second note - might not be the officiating at all but the coaching/team. Might want to encourage the coaches to provide comments/feedback to the league on the teams they play. I am guessing they can do that today but I honestly don't know. You might find that your team was not the only team who believed that a game was out of hand vs a specific opponent.

As many have stated here the vast majority of parents don't know/understand the laws of the game yet the scream at the refs as if they do and then make the "correct call" from their chair on the sideline...and then say things like the ref was out of position or "looked away". Funny how a parent can make the correct call from off the field and then say that the ref was out of position. As if they have a better position with their butt planted in a chair on the sideline. I firmly believe that is the problem most of time not bad officiating. Yes, refs miss calls/fouls, etc. it even happens at the World Cup but they get more right that almost any parent on the sideline would.

Lastly - if the officiating is that bad and your DD's are at risk you team should walk off the field. I saw this occur at Ross Stewart 7-8 years ago where a team walked off the field in a tournament.
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Re: 00 OFFICIATING 10/10/2016

Post by Rudder on 22/10/16, 09:20 am

Hobbit,
I have nothing to do with this specific incident, but some feedback on some of your points. They seem logical, and in a perfect world, would be valid. However, this is youth soccer in North Texas, and logic does not apply. We have seen extremely poor officiating in games that my children have either won or loss. We have filed reports, looked to tournament / league officials at that venue, and asked for oversight from other officials. The answer is always the same, "there's nothing we can do about it because there just aren't enough referees." I do understand the Laws of the game, and I do realize that human error, point of view, and parental biases can lead to disagreement over some calls. But when the game is allowed to resemble a rugby match more then a soccer match things are out of control. Now, as for walking off the field, do you know what the result of that action is? The coach is called in front of a committee, fined a couple hundred dollars, and suspended for a game or two. When it happened to our coach, we gladly pitched in to cover the fine because the kid's safety is more important, but it just goes to show you the focus of soccer here, at least from the administration's point of view. So what's the fix? I wish I knew. I do believe that first, we have watered down "select" soccer to be just "pay-to-play." I would like to see a single "select" league, and anyone not making those teams stay in the recreational development track (yes, that would mean a couple of my kids would probably be at the Y instead of "select"). But, by doing so, it would allow the limited pool of truly qualified referees to cover these games. The recreational level should discourage over-aggressive physical play, instead focusing on skill development and team tactics. Will this solve the problem, I don;t know. will it ever happen - no. We are a society that tries to turn our kids into professional athletes as young as possible. No longer do we focus on flag football as the kids develop the skills for the game - we jump right into NFL - like pads and rules. No longer do we focus on small-sided, skill based soccer games, we make 10 year olds run around on a full-sized pitch encouraging physical play over skill and tactics. And as long as there's money coming in, it will continue...

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