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Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

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Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by bad_daddy on Mon Apr 03, 2017 12:08 pm

I have watched several USMNT, USWNT, LaLiga, EPL, Championship League and others be in an offside position and play the ball back at kick-off.  I understand it is illegal, but the referees don't call it because it is not an "advantage."  Do any of the LH Teams and/or any other teams send the ball back from an offside position?  I coach a U10G team (rec  Very Happy ) and had my 9 stand offsides facing my midfielder and play the ball back to her.  The ref let me do it the first time and then stated I could not do it.  That said, I believe it is the future and more and more teams are going to be doing it.

I know it isn't the biggest topic in the world of soccer, but interesting.

Thanks for your feedback.

-Al

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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by bigtex75081 on Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:18 pm

When you say "kick-off" do you mean a "free kick restart"?

A player is in an offside position if he/she is in the opposing team's half of the field and is also nearer to the opponents' goal line than both the ball and the second-last opponent.
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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by bad_daddy on Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:31 pm

Thank for the response bigtex.  Specifically starting the game and 1/2 time.

I'd could post a thousand videos of teams straddling the centerline.  I will post a link to the USWNT v. England and watch Alex Morgan start play from an offside position.

Link:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSkm6yWSNOs

About the 1:02 mark..

England did it as well.

I'm also seeing the YourApeeIn Leagues starting this way.  MLS...I'm not sure.  I don't really watch it too much.

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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by bad_daddy on Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:35 pm

I have tried to edit YourApeeIn to YourApeeIn several times and it will not let me......oh well

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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by Zizou on Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:47 pm

Lol, admin strikes again!

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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by bad_daddy on Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:48 pm

What the ......

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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by Zizou on Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:50 pm

Yep, admin won't let you correct it. It's been built into the system for years.

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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by bigtex75081 on Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:54 pm

OK... You're referring to straddling the midfield stripe during a kickoff, correct?  Kinda like an offensive lineman lining up in the neutral zone in football.  In soccer, offsides has an enitrely different meaning... In soccer it's more like the offsides rule (blue lines) in hockey. In soccer (and in hockey) you can't just station a player next to the goalie anymore... that player would be offsides.

I don't think you should care if the players are straddling the line at kickoff IF the ball goes backwards to start.  

If the ball is played forward TO THAT PLAYER that was straddling the line, and it gave that player an advantage, then you might complain.

Don't overthink soccer.  Our Laws of the Game are short and easy.  We do not have a long list of rules that must be abided by.  The NFL has a rule book that's 500+ pages long.  You won't find that in soccer.  Honestly... Offsides is the most complicated rule we have in soccer.
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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by Zizou on Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:04 pm

Handling can be complicated.

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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by 5050Ball on Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:08 pm

bad_daddy wrote:Thank for the response bigtex.  Specifically starting the game and 1/2 time.

I'd could post a thousand videos of teams straddling the centerline.  I will post a link to the USWNT v. England and watch Alex Morgan start play from an offside position.

Link:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSkm6yWSNOs

About the 1:02 mark..

England did it as well.

I'm also seeing the YourApeeIn Leagues starting this way.  MLS...I'm not sure.  I don't really watch it too much.

Interestingly, when they changed the Law from ball moving 'forward' to simply ball 'moving', one of the desired effects was to get that one offensive player into his own half, which was and is, still part of the Law.

But old habits die hard and most referees put this one into the trifling category. A stickler would have the kick retaken.

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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by bad_daddy on Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:21 pm

That was kinda my point.  If the ball goes back and there is not advantage...play on?  I coached my striker to play the ball back from an offside position attempting to have my mid control the field and let the rest of my girls open up into space and/or make some passing connections or look for a thru-ball.  That said, I thought it was silly not to allow the striker to either straddle the line or be offside facing the midfielder when there was no advantage given....instead of swiping her leg around the ball for a pass back to the midfielder....I dunno.

Any of the top tier LH teams play this way?

One of the other teams in our little league plays the ball back as well.  I am going to watch and see how they do it.

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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by 5050Ball on Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:34 pm

It's not really an offside position. The halfway line is not a line of scrimmage. It's a technicality for a proper restart.

Think of it like a goal kick. The ball is not in play until it leaves the area. So if a defender swoops in and takes it before it leaves the area: whistle. It never happened.

On a kick-off, the very first thing that must be in place is "all players in their own half". So again, technically all those kick-offs you see with a player in the defensive half never actually happened. Referees just choose to ignore it.

My dd's team plays every kick-off back to maintain possession. They are able to do this AND remain in their half until the ball is played. That is what you will see most of the top tier teams doing.
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Re: Starting Offsides on a Kick-Off.

Post by bigtex75081 on Mon Apr 03, 2017 5:27 pm

Zizou wrote:Handling can be complicated.
I agree that handling can also be a little confusing because intent has a lot to do with the referee's decision.  A handball occurs if a player, other than the team's goalkeeper within his/her own penalty area, deliberately handles the ball when in play. A ball can be handled with any part of the arm, from the tips of a player's fingers right up to the shoulder.

"Deliberately" is the key word there.  Because of that 1 word, the ref is stuck asking himself/herself the same questions when the ball is handled during play...
1.  "Did the player's hand hit the ball OR did the ball hit the player's hand?"  If the ball went into the player's hand without intent by the player, that's generally called ball-to-hand.  Ball-to-hand decisions are not fouls.
2.  "Did the player's team gain an advantage from handling the ball?"  If no advantage is gained, the referee can let them play on.

If we're 3 feet apart and I, without warning, launch the soccer ball into your hand as you try to protect yourself... Is that a handball foul on you?  I doubt many referees would call that against you.  In that situation, most referees would call that ball-to-hand.

If there's a wall in front of the goal and all the male players are standing there covering their junk, can you simply slam the ball into a guy's crotch at 100mph to get a handball called and be awarded a penalty kick?  No, most referees would call that ball-to-hand unless the player in the wall intentionally moved his hand into the ball.
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