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Open Tryouts

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Open Tryouts

Post by goalkeeperdad on 12/06/18, 12:45 am

Is it just me or do open tryouts now go on forever?

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by brazos on 12/06/18, 08:00 am

Yes. On and on...hoping and praying for that one superstar to show up.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by MurderWasTheCase on 12/06/18, 08:14 am

Most teams are waiting until the last minute to communicate offers which is frustrating for everyone. I know of several teams with 10-11 players waiting for the other to blow up so they can sweep up whats left.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by Yo on 12/06/18, 08:26 am

brazos wrote:Yes.  On and on...hoping and praying for that one superstar to show up.

She's moving in from Southern Cal next week

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by NoSpinZone on 12/06/18, 08:37 am

Yo wrote:
brazos wrote:Yes.  On and on...hoping and praying for that one superstar to show up.

She's moving in from Southern Cal next week

Solar offered her a full ride, sight unseen, is the rumor. lol

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by goalkeeperdad on 12/06/18, 09:36 am

If you try DA and either don't make it or decide that you still want to play other sports, these tryouts could be a 2 month+ deal. If you test out other clubs and your club makes (highly encourages) you come to tryouts, you could have 4-6 tryout practices per week.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by AlittleBitofSanity on 12/06/18, 09:42 am

or you can have the coach offer your kid a spot, and if you don't respond by the next day, they blackball you. they all show their cards eventually.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by Butfirstsoccer09 on 12/06/18, 10:04 am

brazos wrote:Yes.  On and on...hoping and praying for that one superstar to show up.

Meanwhile existing players do not know where they stand. But it is all about the kids, right? Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by TxFutbal on 12/06/18, 10:19 am

The quality coaches with quality teams have already committed to their girls/girls committed to their coach/teammates, and their rosters are locked for the most part. If you build for the future instead of the playing for the gold medal each week, you don't have these problems.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by DeltaTauChi on 12/06/18, 10:22 am

You folks do realize that this is a competitive “select” sport, and if you or your DD don’t like it, you don’t have to participate, right?

Think about it, if you aren’t confident with where your kid stands with any particular coach/team by now, what do you think the chances are that you’ll end up happy during the upcoming year?


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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by Big Ern on 12/06/18, 11:05 am

DTX + Futbal are full of wisdom and truth ^ ...

Butfirst09 -- Just in case you were referring to your own situation ... If your kid was and existing player and still doesn't know where she stands, you may wanna look elsewhere.

Good luck out there!

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by MurderWasTheCase on 12/06/18, 11:29 am

Butfirstsoccer09 wrote:
brazos wrote:Yes.  On and on...hoping and praying for that one superstar to show up.

Meanwhile existing players do not know where they stand. But it is all about the kids, right?  Rolling Eyes  Rolling Eyes  Rolling Eyes

Thats because everyone is waiting for the unicorn to showup before making offers or commitments.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by TxFutbal on 12/06/18, 11:52 am

Unicorns are mythical and fleeting creatures that will destroy your team.. Don't get caught up in beauty of their play or get sucked into the gold medals they will bring your team.. You can't catch and cage a unicorn.. They will leave and destroy your team in the process because their parents think they are the next Pugh/Morgan/Heath/pick a star...

Build your team on a solid foundation with a core group of great girls/parents and then grow your soccer family with the right girls as your soccer family changes. By the time your team is 15/16 you will be competing for regional/national championships because the speed/size levels out and field is right sized.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by MurderWasTheCase on 12/06/18, 12:37 pm

TxFutbal wrote:Unicorns are mythical and fleeting creatures that will destroy your team.. Don't get caught up in beauty of their play or get sucked into the gold medals they will bring your team.. You can't catch and cage a unicorn.. They will leave and destroy your team in the process because their parents think they are the next Pugh/Morgan/Heath/pick a star...

Build your team on a solid foundation with a core group of great girls/parents and then grow your soccer family with the right girls as your soccer family changes.  By the time your team is 15/16 you will be competing for regional/national championships because the speed/size levels out and field is right sized.

Well done sir, this is exactly what everyone needs to understand. cheers

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by HotSpur25 on 12/06/18, 01:11 pm

TxFutbal wrote:Unicorns are mythical and fleeting creatures that will destroy your team.. Don't get caught up in beauty of their play or get sucked into the gold medals they will bring your team.. You can't catch and cage a unicorn.. They will leave and destroy your team in the process because their parents think they are the next Pugh/Morgan/Heath/pick a star...

Build your team on a solid foundation with a core group of great girls/parents and then grow your soccer family with the right girls as your soccer family changes.  By the time your team is 15/16 you will be competing for regional/national championships because the speed/size levels out and field is right sized.

TxFutbal, you win best post of the year so far.  The question is where do you find teams that believe in your philosophy.  Please note that I stated "teams," not coaches.  Coaches and parents are both to blame for the present status of youth sports.  On a recent podcast, they were discussing the lessons that adults and coaches teach their kids by their actions.  For instance, if you are constantly holding tryouts and looking for new players, you are teaching that loyalty does not matter.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by MurderWasTheCase on 12/06/18, 01:26 pm

The problem as well know is youth soccer has turned into a business and a paycheck for some. I know some coaches who's soccer is the only source of income for their family.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by DeltaTauChi on 12/06/18, 01:56 pm

HotSpur25 wrote:
TxFutbal wrote:Unicorns are mythical and fleeting creatures that will destroy your team.. Don't get caught up in beauty of their play or get sucked into the gold medals they will bring your team.. You can't catch and cage a unicorn.. They will leave and destroy your team in the process because their parents think they are the next Pugh/Morgan/Heath/pick a star...

Build your team on a solid foundation with a core group of great girls/parents and then grow your soccer family with the right girls as your soccer family changes.  By the time your team is 15/16 you will be competing for regional/national championships because the speed/size levels out and field is right sized.

TxFutbal, you win best post of the year so far.  The question is where do you find teams that believe in your philosophy.  Please note that I stated "teams," not coaches.  Coaches and parents are both to blame for the present status of youth sports.  On a recent podcast, they were discussing the lessons that adults and coaches teach their kids by their actions.  For instance, if you are constantly holding tryouts and looking for new players, you are teaching that loyalty does not matter.

Loyalty in competitive youth sports is a highly fleeting concept. Can you find it? Sure. Should you expect it? If you do, you'll likely end up bitterly disappointed at some point along the journey.

Loyalty will last only as long as each party involved (player, parents, coach, club) believes that it is in their collective best interest to maintain the status quo. The moment one or more of the parties deems otherwise, forget it, it's gone. Then, the only question is how emotional any of you want to get over the breakup, as opposed to simply recognizing the situation and figuring out how to just move on.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by TxFutbal on 12/06/18, 02:43 pm

These teams do exist.. In the younger ages (U11 and U12) you will find them in many cases in the D2/D3 tiers.

In the U14/15s you will find them in the lower end of D1 and the Upper end of D2.

These teams all have a similar pattern.. They have very low turnover, their performances can be uneven at times (winning games they should lose and losing games they should win on paper), and their record/rise is gradual over multiple seasons.

They also have had the same coach for multiple years and the turnover they do have is based on the bottom tier of the roster where the coach/players decide where they are best positioned to maximize playing time. These coaches freely give players that need more playing time ample opportunity to guest play on sister teams/JDL/or other clubs as needed for the benefit of the player where there is a significant difference in the level of development of kids not getting playing time vs. kids that are getting most of the playing time.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by AlittleBitofSanity on 12/06/18, 02:57 pm

TxFutbal wrote:These teams do exist.. In the younger ages (U11 and U12) you will find them in many cases in the D2/D3 tiers.

In the U14/15s you will find them in the lower end of D1 and the Upper end of D2.  

These teams all have a similar pattern.. They have very low turnover, their performances can be uneven at times (winning games they should lose and losing games they should win on paper), and their record/rise is gradual over multiple seasons.  

They also have had the same coach for multiple years and the turnover they do have is based on the bottom tier of the roster where the coach/players decide where they are best positioned to maximize playing time.  These coaches freely give players that need more playing time ample opportunity to guest play on sister teams/JDL/or other clubs as needed for the benefit of the player where there is a significant difference in the level of development of kids not getting playing time vs. kids that are getting most of the playing time.


cheers definitely think that as parents we are the ones choosing between moving our children to the best team, or staying where we are. we live vicariously through our children if we want to admit it or not. there- I just admitted it. we haven't seen the lower divisions, but believe you are probably right. every year our club brings out tons of kids for tryouts. they are not looking to replace 1 or 2 kids. they will replace the whole lot if it makes them better. key word is "them" as they truthfully don't care about your children. I think soccer coaches may be the only people that parents have to ask permission to go on vacation.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by DeltaTauChi on 12/06/18, 03:03 pm

TxFutbal wrote:These teams do exist.. In the younger ages (U11 and U12) you will find them in many cases in the D2/D3 tiers.

In the U14/15s you will find them in the lower end of D1 and the Upper end of D2.  

These teams all have a similar pattern.. They have very low turnover, their performances can be uneven at times (winning games they should lose and losing games they should win on paper), and their record/rise is gradual over multiple seasons.  

They also have had the same coach for multiple years and the turnover they do have is based on the bottom tier of the roster where the coach/players decide where they are best positioned to maximize playing time.  These coaches freely give players that need more playing time ample opportunity to guest play on sister teams/JDL/or other clubs as needed for the benefit of the player where there is a significant difference in the level of development of kids not getting playing time vs. kids that are getting most of the playing time.

Slightly over-generalized, but mostly on-point. You can find teams with strong "core loyalty" at any level, but general the rule is that that closer you get to the top rungs of the competitive ladder, the more the adult (and I use that term loosely) egos get in the way, on both sides of the fence (parents and coach/club), and tend muck things up.

You can also find plenty of completely dysfunctional teams at the lower levels as well.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by Big Ern on 13/06/18, 11:02 pm

AlittleBitofSanity wrote:
TxFutbal wrote:These teams do exist.. In the younger ages (U11 and U12) you will find them in many cases in the D2/D3 tiers.

In the U14/15s you will find them in the lower end of D1 and the Upper end of D2.  

These teams all have a similar pattern.. They have very low turnover, their performances can be uneven at times (winning games they should lose and losing games they should win on paper), and their record/rise is gradual over multiple seasons.  

They also have had the same coach for multiple years and the turnover they do have is based on the bottom tier of the roster where the coach/players decide where they are best positioned to maximize playing time.  These coaches freely give players that need more playing time ample opportunity to guest play on sister teams/JDL/or other clubs as needed for the benefit of the player where there is a significant difference in the level of development of kids not getting playing time vs. kids that are getting most of the playing time.


cheers definitely think that as parents we are the ones choosing between moving our children to the best team, or staying where we are.  we live vicariously through our children if we want to admit it or not.   there- I just admitted it.   we haven't seen the lower divisions, but believe you are probably right.    every year our club brings out tons of kids for tryouts.   they are not looking to replace 1 or 2 kids.   they will replace the whole lot if it makes them better.   key word is "them" as they truthfully don't care about your children.   I think soccer coaches may be the only people that parents have to ask permission to go on vacation.  

Greetings lil'sanity --

While your self awareness here regarding living vicariously is admiral, to say that them (whether you mean club, coach or both) "truthfully don't care about your children" is ludicrous.  

***

For what it's worth, I'd also add that the theme of this thread has become a bit too 'team centric' in nature.  As DTX mentioned earlier, this is "Select" soccer and, in this market especially, is uber competitive.  While an element of 'team' has some significance, 'environment' is far more important when it comes to your kid's growth at the higher levels.  This is evident when looking at how things are done in the most competitive soccer environments and clubs around the world ... Kids don't stick with the same kids throughout the gamut of their youth soccer careers, and in my opinion (as well as most other coaches) it is detrimental to most be with the same coach for more than a couple years after U12 or so.  Sticking with the same kids regardless of ability and the same coach's voice for more than a few years is for those kids and families in it for the fun alone (which is fantastic for some), but rather than winning "national championships", those kids will more likely be winning the silver division at the Shawnee Trail Shootout.  

And I think it was ole Snoop that brought up the fact that some coaches do this for a living ... The reality is that this is the case for likely more than many of you think.  For some, especially at the higher levels, their livelihoods are based on the performance/decision making of teenaged kids ... scary stuff when you think about it.  While these are extreme cases, varying levels of this do often exist for these guys, which means that 'loyalty', quite rightly, isn't much in play.  'Perceived loyalty' in reality is based on performance, which applies in multiple directions ... coach-kid, kid-coach, parent-coach.

Again -- these are competitive sports being played in a highly competitive environment.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by TxFutbal on 14/06/18, 06:53 am

Good conversation.. An idea to help parents understand which path to take.. Instead of having league names like DA/ECNL/ECNL2/FDA/LHGCL etc.. How about we have 3 simple paths for parents and players to choose:

1. Soccer is a job path where kids and coaches are aligned on performance goals. Coach earns a living coaching/winning national championships. Players sign multi-year contracts that provide a scholarship to wherever or earn spot on national team whatever if performance goals are met..

2. Soccer is competitive but not a job. kids learn how to play soccer, develop over time, and learn skills needed to have options when it comes time to decide what they want to do after middle school and high school. Parents get to live thru their kids at a pretty high level and talk about the trip to wherever the team went and how they kicked butt or lost in the finals cuz the ref was horrible. This path gives girls an option to play soccer in college at lower end of D1/D2/D3 levels if they work hard and decide to extend their soccer career.

3. Soccer is fun/soccer is a culture. Kids learn how to play soccer to determine if they want be competitive one day. Parents take a ton of pictures and videos for the memory books.. Childhood friendships are made and there are lot's of parties. Coaches know what they are doing but have a day job that pays the bills. Coach focused 100% on development/preparation similar to what our teachers in our schools are charged with every day.

The issue we have is at the most competitive levels is coaches and clubs are rewarded for their performance and players are commodities with no voice. One could say players have a voice with their feet by leaving one team for another, but this is not a real voice because changing teams every year is detrimental to both soccer and social development. When we align player performance at the highest levels with coach/club performance, then we will have balance.

The other 2 paths are great options for 99% of our NTX girls. Parents just need to know where these paths are on the soccer map.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by Zizou on 14/06/18, 07:40 am

What you would find is a lot of parents would choose path one holding on to a chance that little suzzie could be a super star. Slot two would disappear for the same reason. My DD although in second division can compete at the top. Third one has a chance, but any signs of success and the parents will be looking to move up. A lot of times it not the system that is the problem. Change the parent and some times the player and your idea would work.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by TxFutbal on 14/06/18, 08:20 am

Very true Zizuo.. I have a proposed solution to this one..

1. At tier 1. Tryouts will weed out 80% of the over zealous parents cuz coaches won't be able to pad the pocket book with bench players due to player development performance criteria in their contract.
2. At tier 1 Kids contracts have performance clause that if they don't reach certain % of playing time, they relegate down until they are able to perform their contract.
3. Tier 3 to tier 2 is an easy one. Players will know when it's time to move up and we have a normal tryout process for that. Parents will understand there is a definite change in culture where the focus is on team development and player takes ownership of individual development.
4. Tier 2 to Tier 1 will be the hardest transition as it should rightfully be. Tier 1 is top 1-2% and it should be hard and only for the most dedicated/talented kids.

Right now coaches/club sell the dream that every kid could be in the top 1-2% because they have to maximize revenue/profits. Coaches/clubs would certainly act differently towards the kids they offer spots to at the highest levels if there were equal accountability/performance metrics. Kids who are not ready for the jump to the highest level would not be offered spots. Parents would get a big dose of reality when a coach/club tells a player she is not ready and I can't take your money to give you a spot to develop because I can't hit my performance metrics and keep my job with you on my roster.

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Re: Open Tryouts

Post by FroZone on 14/06/18, 08:25 am

Zizou wrote:What you would find is a lot of parents would choose path one holding on to a chance that little suzzie could be a super star. Slot two would disappear for the same reason. My DD although in second division can compete at the top. Third one has a chance, but any signs of success and the parents will be looking to move up. A lot of times it not the system that is the problem. Change the parent and some times the player and your idea would work.

Great insight Zizou. Just imagine if you had taken your own advice.
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