Re: Team Bye vs Club Bye

by Big Ern 24/07/18, 10:50 pm

SoccerSuckers wrote:Rural America has tons of Dairy Queens w that soft serve. Put soccer back into schools nationwide communities will foot the bill Pops that owns 13 Dairy Queen Franchises will fork out the soft serve ice cream for the big game.

The diary queen mascot will be passing out free soft serve cones for purchased tickets. East Texas boy Dempsey from Nac loves his Dairy Queen soft serve w pops.

Bridget Jones?

by SuperCoach 24/07/18, 10:51 pm

dats..wUt I'm talkin bouT ….fity….fity

by tikitalker 25/07/18, 06:39 am

SoccerSuckers wrote:Rural America has tons of Dairy Queens w that soft serve. Put soccer back into schools nationwide communities will foot the bill Pops that owns 13 Dairy Queen Franchises will fork out the soft serve ice cream for the big game.

The diary queen mascot will be passing out free soft serve cones for purchased tickets. East Texas boy Dempsey from Nac loves his Dairy Queen soft serve w pops.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nl7XUDJiJ_k

by BENDMEOVER 25/07/18, 07:18 am

The talent of Dempsey drove hours so he could play the game. How many kids choose not too, how to quantify that? Soccer will continue to decline if we dont grow the avenues for our talent. The schools need the sport back its should be priority one immediately. That can be done now.

by SickofStupidity 25/07/18, 08:55 am

SoccerSuckers wrote:The talent of Dempsey drove hours so he could play the game. How many kids choose not too, how to quantify that? Soccer will continue to decline if we dont grow the avenues for our talent. The schools need the sport back its should be priority one immediately. That can be done now.

Wishful thinking.

Most high schools, if given the option of hiring an experienced soccer coach or their 20th football coach, would easily spend the money on another football coach first.

by Zizou 25/07/18, 09:06 am

Truth, plus I don’t think an overhaul of the entire system is necessary to seek out talent in every crack in the US. Public schools in Texas have concerns for one sport. The one that fills an entire stadium on Friday nights. “Friday Night lights” pays for an entire athletic budgets for some schools.

by Defender_Dad 25/07/18, 09:37 am

SoccerSuckers wrote:The talent of Dempsey drove hours so he could play the game. How many kids choose not too, how to quantify that? Soccer will continue to decline if we dont grow the avenues for our talent. The schools need the sport back its should be priority one immediately. That can be done now.

It's time for a new bit fella. Soccer in Texas has never been as big in schools as you seem to think.

by sonnyspurs07 25/07/18, 09:59 am

[quote="DeltaTauChi"]

sonnyspurs07 wrote:But does the NFL, MLB, NBA or NHL pay a single dime to develop their own players here?

Yeah, I misstated what I was trying to say here. Meant to say: does the NFL, MLB, NBA or NHL pay a single dime to develop YOUTH players in this country? (I would say that development of a player once they are past 18 years old is much different. It's teaching them how to be a pro). Of course they don't, there is simply no incentive to. Because either the schools or the parents (ie select clubs) will do it for them. And anyway, the kids entry to those leagues is through the amateur draft, so any hold you would have had on a kid in developing him would be erased at that point anyway. But that goes to my point that our sports culture is not the YourApeeIn sports culture. We can't just port what they do over there and plug it in here and dust off our hands and say "mission accomplished". And schools are not the answer either. First, until football goes away (which I'm not holding my breath), there's no oxygen to grow another sport. And second, school sports will never be year round (not even football!).

I agree with just about everything in your post DTX, except that I don't think the NCAA is really doing any developing for the NBA. They are playing for 1 year, and even that's about to go away. For the most part, these kids have already been tagged by the time they are juniors in high school. They just go to Duke or Kentucky for a year because the league requires them to.

I can't say I have any answers that don't involve a complete overhaul of the way we view youth athletes. Allowing them to sign pro contracts at 16 would be a start. MLB clubs sign carribbean players when they are 16, but the ones from the USA? You have to wait until you're 18. And for football, 20. But if you could sign a kid at 16, that gives all leagues (not just the MLS) an incentive to develop youth players.

But a shift in sports culture like that doesn't happen overnight. I think it will have to happen in another sport first before it makes its way to soccer. I think the NBA is most likely. Mark Cuban has even said on record that he would like the league to start getting into the business of youth development academies. But if they go down that road, they'll also need to get rid of the draft.

But at the end of the day, is it really that bad that the USA can't compete with Europe and South America in soccer? Our sport is what it is, and we shouldn't be angry that it's not something else. We should continue to try and improve it. But the sport exists in an ecosystem that doesn't have an analogy to anywhere else in the world. And that's OK!

by brazos 25/07/18, 10:13 am

Defender_Dad wrote:
SoccerSuckers wrote:The talent of Dempsey drove hours so he could play the game. How many kids choose not too, how to quantify that? Soccer will continue to decline if we dont grow the avenues for our talent. The schools need the sport back its should be priority one immediately. That can be done now.

It's time for a new bit fella. Soccer in Texas has never been as big in schools as you seem to think.

What do you mean? The 50 or so parents and siblings that attend school games can't compare to the 1000's or 10,000's that go to football games Laughing

by BENDMEOVER 25/07/18, 01:11 pm

At the end of day if we want soccer to decline and be mediocrity on the world stage and not grow outside our little bubble then that's where we are at and will stay.

by Lefty 25/07/18, 04:26 pm

DeltaTauChi wrote:
sonnyspurs07 wrote:But does the NFL, MLB, NBA or NHL pay a single dime to develop their own players here?

NFL doesn't have to because the High Schools and NCAA are doing it for them. In the US, football is a revenue generator at both the High School and NCAA level. There's a reason why in most Texas school systems that the Varsity Football Coach is usually the 2nd highest paid employee in the district after the Superintendent. The amount of money in NCAA football is redonkulous and that is paying for an extensive network of assistant coaches who are all getting paid to go out to both scout and develop talent. Basically, it's what soccer is in all those countries we aspire to be like. Not to mention all the money Nike, UA, etc. are dumping into college programs and running elite talent ID camps. The High Schools and NCAA are essentially your minor leagues, doing the heavy lifting on player development.

NBA is pretty much the same thing. Again, a huge money generator at the NCAA level, paying for a network of coaches to go out and scout and develop the talent, not to mention the money the shoe and apparel companies are dumping into things like AAU. AAU, HS, and NCAA doing the heavy lifting on player development in the US.

MLB might not spend much money on talent development, for ages under 18, but they spend HUGE money on scouting and identifying talent at the younger ages, not just in the US, but all over Central/South America and the Carribean. MLB also spends HUGE money on talent development from ages 18+. At least 5 levels of minor leagues in the US. However, it should also be noted that while the US has the dominant professional league, the US as a nation no longer dominates the makeup of that league, nor do they dominate on the World Stage like the US does in football or basketball. US Baseball doesn't lag as much as US Soccer, but we have not dominated the Olympics or WBC the way we have dominated Basketball or Football.

NHL is a complete different beast, as it's a much more regional sport, than any of the others.

The bottom line is that football, basketball, and baseball generate far more money in ticket sales, merchandise sales, broadcast revenue, advertising revenue, etc., than soccer does in the US, not just at the professional level, but at the college and HS level, and that trickles down through the system. Even that hasn't completely eliminated pay-to-play in those other sports. Until similar money starts flowing from those sources into soccer in the US, you won't put much of a dent into the pay-to-play model. JMHO.

Or become relevant on the world stage in men's soccer.

We do just fine on the women's side with the pay to play model for two reasons:
. Higher quality of athletes selecting soccer. No NBA, NFL or BB $ to chase
. No significant revenue streams for women's soccer in other countries that we have to compete with, so we are on fairly even footing.

by Big Ern 25/07/18, 04:42 pm

That ^ reminds me ...

I forgot to mention Lefty amongst the "smart people" earlier --

by Zizou 25/07/18, 07:35 pm

DAVIES COMPLETES MLS RECORD $13.5 MILLION MOVE TO BAYERN MUNICH. More of these and money will begin to grow for youth development.

Chris Richards on loan from FC Dallas could be the next big transfer fee from a home grown to Bayern Munich.

by BENDMEOVER 25/07/18, 09:16 pm

Watch "chain smoker monkey" on YouTube
https://youtu.be/i4YToIdis10

The monkey needs a banana. I'm starting to think he is smarter than some of the people running soccer. Until we expand the market to all communities you cant sell the product. All other sports are played everywhere except for soccer. There's plenty of revenue to go around to make everyone happy. Have a little common sense. Instead of shrinking the market and killing the sport embrace the schools as a partner.

by Lefty 26/07/18, 10:50 am

SoccerSuckers wrote:Watch "chain smoker monkey" on YouTube
https://youtu.be/i4YToIdis10

The monkey needs a banana. I'm starting to think he is smarter than some of the people running soccer. Until we expand the market to all communities you cant sell the product. All other sports are played everywhere except for soccer. There's plenty of revenue to go around to make everyone happy. Have a little common sense. Instead of shrinking the market and killing the sport embrace the schools as a partner.

I'm pretty sure that everyone in the 'soccer industry' in the US would love for every middle school and high school in all of America to field both boys and girls soccer teams.

How do you propose to make that happen?

by Zizou 26/07/18, 10:52 am

Crickets......... cherp, cherp

by BENDMEOVER 26/07/18, 01:47 pm

They would have to register the programs through their governing body. It would have to be approved to be offered at all the schools middle and HS. Elementaries would be organized within the school district w parent volunteers if a school doesnt have enough within district play other local schools.. It's not rocket science a little bit of work by the community shouldn't be difficult. This will allow smaller communities the options to play the game that otherwise they have to travel to a major city on top of the dues. It will be alot cheaper for those players to stay home. This will in turn produce more kids playing the game to promote outside the schools.

Zizou job is to be the liaison between the clubs and schools to help promote this agenda and start marketing this product immediately. Soccer has been around a heck of alot longer than most sports. People want to play the game but have no access.

by Zizou 26/07/18, 02:14 pm

Sports as we speak in Texas are not offered in the schools until students are in 7th grade. Most if not all schools from that point offer soccer until a kid graduates. The opportunity has been their for ever and never once did UIL try to run with it. Why, football, football, football. Good luck beating out football in small towns of Texas.

by BENDMEOVER 26/07/18, 02:18 pm

Elementafy leagues is parent volunteering and allowing their kids this opportunity the school adminstration will have no problem letting the kids use their facilities to do this. Administration leaders have kids or friends that play or would like to play soccer. Football is only one sport and most kids dont even play that game.either size or interest. Provide another sport option for the others. Kids of all ethnicity would be very interested in this platform and their parents would volunteer.

This is one solution. To me this is the least investment and something that can be instituted quickly.

This would provide more players to pool and teams for the clubs that want to expand in outer locations and the kids that want extra practice and play beyond the school leagues. Possibly creating regional leagues versus metroplex offerings.

by smugrr 26/07/18, 03:21 pm

Public schools in Texas are not allowed to use, as coach, someone who is not a full time employee of the school district. Private schools may do so and do that. That, in part, is why some early play based on school affiliation is through the Y.

by BENDMEOVER 26/07/18, 03:28 pm

Middle school and HS would be an employee the elementary would not be governed by them. It is strictly volunteer w the approval.of the school for access to their facilities. If that is an obstacle then there would be fees for field rental or voluntary access for games.

by dadof3 27/07/18, 12:47 am

I have read the posts and can’t exactly determine if the call for schools to be responsible for organizing soccer is real or not, but I am gonna throw my thought in.
First, the school governing body is UIL. They have rules (like no pass, no play) and districting. That is already in place.

Seriously ask yourself if you would rather have your 7th grader coached by his science teacher who gets paid a pittance and SHOULD BE more focused on education, or the club coach who YOU CHOSE, who is actually licensed and you assume knows soccer. The reason that middle schools have soccer AT ALL is because community cries for it. Why is their season 6-8 games? Who is the coach of that team? Because every conflict is catastrophic one way on the other. Now have that same 7th grade science teacher make cuts? Decisions on playing time? Decisions on positions? Or...let’s actually fund it...raise taxes to pay the club coach that may have NO business in a school focus solely on soccer and be paid a salary that can even sniff his current club salary.

Maybe instead we consider time...what OTHER sports and activities does your kid do in 7/8th grade? Maybe band or theater? Maybe runs cross country (and actually shows more talent there)? Maybe it turns out that his athletic career is shortened by injury or lack of interest in playing a game as a job at 13, but the opportunity to try something else was consumed by dedication to the single most important thing in YOUR life...now whose fault is it that your kid has a school career focused on sports, not education-market that in the real world. I see a law suit v. School.

But wait, we can compare it to football in other ways...Football has NO competition for your time...if you are a hard core football player, EVERYTHING in your life revolves around football. In elementary school you play flag/tackle football in a Peewee league until the reins are handed over to middle school coaches...all your workouts and off season are built around Friday (or Thursday) night lights and every other activity bends to it. Soccer can’t have the same level...nor would you want it. My guess is that you haven’t seen much high school soccer or talked to many parents of players if you feel that handing the reins of your kid’s soccer career to the high school coach seems like a great solution. If you think the forum is bad for spewing venom about club soccer coaches, sit in the stands at ALMOST ANY high school...

Football comparison part 2...Imagine a school like Allen with 6k plus students in their building centered around a soccer team...how many kids would fall through the cracks when you only chose a 25 man varsity roster? In football, there are probably 40 significant players (20 offense and 20 defense) and 30 more who offer something occasionally for a play or two. Then 20 more who NEVER play unless the spread is 35+ points. That means that on the VARSITY team you have nearly 100 kids then you have several sub-varsity with at least 50 per team (250 kids?). But nobody really gets cut. You can be a part of the program in some capacity if you want.
Now think soccer...that same 6K and only 3 teams of 25 kids. On each team, 16 have any significant role...5 more fill time rarely and 4 more NEVER play...in a class of 2000 kids?? So the best 25 of each class...if that was the only sport everyone played?? Talk about limiting the sport. Imagine the politics...and you couldn’t go to another school because that wasn’t your district, unless you moved to a new house...and even if you did, you would be scrutinized to determine if the move was for athletics...imagine tryouts with 250 kids in each class trying out...kids getting overlooked? Imagine the outcry at cuts?? Imagine the different playing philosophies or a coach that only cares about size/speed because he has to win or be fired...he cares about development?? Imagine there were no choices?? A year contract was instead an entire high school career...and what if your coach didn’t like something about the way your kid “expressed individuality” on the field or the older brother who caused a problem or your mouth because you complained and so he looks at 13 other kids on the bench who will die to get any time?...and what if you didn’t win most of your games and changed the whole program after 3 years...and the new guy now wanted something else...or was hired by someone who has a grandson at that school.

Honestly, there are so many other issues. Magnifying the school’s role in this is just wrong. Let schools worry about education first and do what they can to create students who also play sports rather than athletes who also attend school. Been to a high school reunion? Worn your letter jacket? Jesus take the wheel.

by BENDMEOVER 27/07/18, 12:15 pm

Zizou I have a job for you. Time is wasting away.

by Zizou 27/07/18, 12:22 pm

I would love to hear about it.

by BENDMEOVER 27/07/18, 12:26 pm

Let's save this sport Zizou. Do me proud.

by Zizou 27/07/18, 12:50 pm

Man, I’m on my way out. My DD and I have done our time. We are onto the next level. Good Luck! Plus negotiating with UIL or even the individual school boards is like talking to a brick wall. Plus my taxes are already the highest in the area. Hopefully they are using this money to increase technology use for student education rather than increaseing numbers playing soccer.

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