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Post by ProphAC on 30/05/19, 01:17 pm

Thank you, soccerisdumb!

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Post by Flash on 30/05/19, 01:27 pm

According to the QT Rules from 2018, no guest players are permitted. The "player pass" concept is typically utilized in league play. I am not familiar with it being in place for qualifying.
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Post by smugrr on 30/05/19, 01:31 pm

Please explain (I am sure it has been previously but I could not find) how the Club player pass system works, which appears to be only for the regular season.

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Post by soccerisdumb on 30/05/19, 01:48 pm

smugrr wrote:Please explain (I am sure it has been previously but I could not find) how the Club player pass system works, which appears to be only for the regular season.

.
G. Club Pass Players
The LHGCL board of directors believes that the rule was incorporated in order to fulfill two
basic needs:
• Foster the development of players by allowing them to participate within their own club at a
higher level of competition without the commitment of a roster transfer.
• To assist teams that may be short sided due to injury, illness, or other commitments.
1. A “Club Pass Player” is defined as a Player that meets all of the following conditions:
20180807 13 Rev 1.5
a. The Club Pass Player shall be a North Texas State Soccer Association (“NTSSA”)
Registered Competitive Player;
b. The Club Pass Player shall be a member of a NTSSA Competitive Club.
2. A Club Pass Player may play regular season League games for other teams within their
Club (referred to as “Receiving Teams” herein) under all of the following restrictions:
a. A Club Pass Player may not “play down” for a team in a younger age group (e.g.,
an under-15 Club Pass Player may not play on an under-14 Receiving Team);
b. A Club Pass Player may appear on one and only one Game Day Roster on a given
day;
3. A Receiving Team may include Club Pass Players on their Game Day Rosters for League
games under all of the following restrictions:
a. A Receiving Team (11U – 18U) may include a maximum of 3 Club Pass Players
on a single Game Day Roster and must comply with their Game Day Roster limit;
Should the addition of Club Pass Player(s) cause the Receiving Team to exceed
their Game Day Roster maximum, the Receiving Team must remove the
appropriate number of their rostered Players to comply with the Receiving Team’s
Game Day Roster limit. For example, suppose an under-14 Receiving Team with a
Game Day Roster limit of 18 Players has 17 Players on its roster. If a request is
approved for 3 Club Player Pass Players to play for that Receiving Team on a given
day, then the Receiving Team must remove at least 2 of its rostered Players from
their Game Day Roster to accommodate the 3 Club Pass players and to comply with
their Game Day Roster limit of 18 Players. Rostered Players that are removed from
the Game Day Roster for this reason may sit on the bench, but may not be dressed
in their game uniform.
b. A Receiving team (11U-18U) may include only 1 “division down” Club Pass Player
on their Game Day Roster. A “division down” player is defined as one who is
rostered to a LHGCL team within the same age group or older age group and from
a higher division than that of the Receiving Team. For example, a Receiving Team
from 13U Division II may add no more than 1 player to the Game Day Roster from
a 13U Division I team.
c. In the final three League games of the Soccer Year (11U – 17U), A Receiving Team
may include 1 Club Pass Player on their Game Day Roster. Should the addition of
Club Pass Player(s) cause the Receiving Team to exceed their Game Day Roster
maximum, the Receiving Team must remove the appropriate number of their
rostered Players to comply with the Receiving Team’s Game Day Roster limit.
d. In the final three League games of the Soccer Year (18U), A Receiving Team may
include 3 Club Pass Player on their Game Day Roster. Should the addition of Club
Pass Player(s) cause the Receiving Team to exceed their Game Day Roster
maximum, the Receiving Team must remove the appropriate number of their
rostered Players to comply with the Receiving Team’s Game Day Roster limit.
e. For 19U only, a Receiving Team may include 5 Club Pass Players on their Game
Day Roster, and without regard to whether the Player is playing "division up" or
"division down".. Should the addition of Club Pass Player(s) cause the Receiving
Team to exceed their Game Day Roster maximum, the Receiving Team must
remove the appropriate number of their rostered Players to comply with the
Receiving Team’s Game Day Roster limit. The 5 player limit will be applicable to
all 19U league games and all 19U league playoff games.
f. A Receiving Team may include Club Pass Players on their Game Day Roster if the
Receiving Team submits the Club Pass Player request on or before the posted
20180807 14 Rev 1.5
deadline. All instructions and deadlines for Club Pass Player Requests can be found
at www.girlsclassicleague.com. The Receiving Team must follow all rules with
regard to uniforms (i.e., no duplicate numbers. Refer to LHGCL rules section IV
paragraph J)
The Club Pass Player is not required to have a North Texas State Soccer Association Release from
their Rostered Team. It is up to the Club to mediate any issues amongst their teams/parents/coaches
relating to Club Pass Players.
The LHGCL Board of Directors reserves the right to determine the eligibility of any Club Pass
Player.
Any coach/team utilizing a Club Pass Player outside of these rules will be considered to have
played and Ineligible Player and will be subject to sanctions/discipline under the rules governing
use of an Ineligible

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Post by smugrr on 30/05/19, 01:55 pm

Now that my head has stopped spinning, can see the issue, especially since there will be 20 teams in division 1, so there will be some mismatches. So a top team, playing team 19 or 20 on a given day, could loan a selected player within their club to a team facing a tough match, so as to help the other team retain an automatically qualifying spot for division 1 for the next year. Or some variation of that scenario.

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Post by USWNT_or_BUST on 30/05/19, 02:34 pm

While it doesnt seem or sound fair, it is just a consolidation of talent, which is what will happen come time for ECNL and DA anyway. Plain and simple top talent will challenge top talent. The big clubs end up having the upper hand in this deal as the independent teams dont have the same availability of talent on a sister team within the same club. The kids that are getting player passed now will migrate to DA or ECNL in a couple years and the rosters will be the top third of many of the top teams now. Win or lose just enjoy the fact that North Texas teams dont have to cross state lines for a challenge.

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Post by nTxsoccRfan on 30/05/19, 03:10 pm

I have also been concerned with having DT Samba, Colvin or Voutier help their sister team(s) get into D1 vía player pass. So, I’m glad to read that no guest players are allowed in the QT.
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Post by smugrr on 30/05/19, 03:20 pm

I do not think any of the sister teams will need help making the top 20, but I agree with you as to being glad there is a rule against that. My suspicion it happened in the old days (but not the oldest days, frozen rosters back then).

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Post by Offsides on 30/05/19, 03:50 pm

Funny about the worries about players being used from the 3 bye teams.. Didnt seem like some of these clubs cared about using players during the season. I know my daughter wont be helping Salsa they are their own team and will have no issue making D1 with their roster. I am proud to say Samba earned their bye without guest players. We have injuries we switch our players on Samba around just like last weekends tournament. We are a team we win and lose as a team.

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Post by ProphAC on 30/05/19, 04:27 pm

Oh great, more guest player debate. Awesome!
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Post by smugrr on 30/05/19, 04:33 pm

Why not? More interesting topic than many I see. As the girls get older, will not be an issue because it will not be a team concept, but a club concept and rosters will be fluid. And winning specific leagues and specific tournaments will not be as big a deal.

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Post by Offsides on 30/05/19, 04:42 pm

Some clubs ugh u can guess trade players around like baseball cards. No injuries.. No development just wanting that Big W because it pulls in more kids and more $$$.. So u tell me who is developing players.

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Post by Eddyinmyyeti on 30/05/19, 05:26 pm

It’s funny that a team that uses a guest player here or there is assumed to not develope it’s players...there are 10-13 other players on that team that make it a top team, not the introduction of a random guest. And that guest isn’t affecting the other girls development. I’ve never been pissed about guest players on other teams unlike some on here.

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Post by ProphAC on 30/05/19, 05:56 pm

I see our team’s players developing just fine with and w/o guest players. I know the Scarfone parents are on a big “no guest players” kick right now because I’m hearing it from parents I know and on Facebook. It’s a rallying cry right now. The thing is, the only game you guys faced guest players was in one of your FCD games, not both. You didn’t face Cosmos Black in either of your White games, you didn’t face a guest player in your one Angelone league game or your Covey games yet you act like you overcame all this guest player adversity. You never faced guest players with DT Vazquez and you didn’t have to play an improved Sting team at all. Hopefully, you guys won’t take my comments the wrong way because I consider some on your sideline friends and I really enjoy our little rivalry... it’s tons of fun. Just giving my take.

I don’t care if other teams have a few guest players but I’m not a fan of a complete team swap and that’s just my opinion... my only concern was for QT and I’m glad nobody will have any... our team included. In other games, I don’t mind my DD and other DDs getting extra touches and I think it’s good for girls to experience different coaching styles. It’s fine... agree to disagree. These boards, at every age division and every year have the same tired debate and we all know the talking points and counterpoints. If you guys want to hash it out AGAIN, have at it... but the day your coach brings a guest player or let’s one of your players guest (and it’s not like it hasn’t ever happened) I trust everyone that feels so strongly about it will be the first ones to tell their coach they are moving on to greener pastures.
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Post by ProDallas on 30/05/19, 06:02 pm

Have any of the 09 teams done a complete team swap?
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Post by ProphAC on 30/05/19, 06:16 pm

I don’t know about others but Angelone played Cosmos Black for their one league game against White and Angelone played the FCD A team in both of their FCD Marin games. You can look at the scores in these games for proof that their was a definite change from these team’s normal results.
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Post by soccertx75 on 30/05/19, 06:26 pm

edited...

While we all debate here, our girls are just enjoying summer and playing the sport they love... We should take a page out of their book occasionally. Wink


Last edited by soccertx75 on 30/05/19, 09:46 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by melashbrew on 30/05/19, 06:54 pm

If a team is short in numbers or has an injured player, I have no problem with guest players. If the team is using them as a strategy to win a close match up...I think that’s cheap. It’s unfortunate when you see regularly rostered players never step foot on the field while guests take their spot.

I don’t think that’s a Samba vs. Angelone argument. I don’t know what Samba never having to play Sting has to do with anything. Lots of good match ups didn’t happen.

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Post by 5050Ball on 30/05/19, 07:36 pm

Much ado about nothing.

Academy was formed specifically for kids to get better coaching without restrictions on movement. Fixed rosters were NEVER the intent.

Of course we didn't foresee that people would be ranking 7-yr old girls back then either.

NTX youth soccer has always been a Darwinian funnel by it's nature. If a couple of new, pony-tailed little faces across the pitch are a concern, it's going to be a long, rough road.
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Post by ProphAC on 30/05/19, 08:21 pm

Melashbrew, it definitely isn’t a Scarfone vs Angelone argument. I believe my daughter guested with your old team for a tournament or two. I don’t remember outrage back then. We are taking this whole issue way too seriously. The opposing team to a team with guest players always believes the opposing team brought guest players, “just to win”... it is what it is.


Last edited by ProphAC on 30/05/19, 08:48 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by ProDallas on 30/05/19, 08:28 pm

ProphAC wrote:I don’t know about others but Angelone played Cosmos Black for their one league game against White and Angelone played the FCD A team in both of their FCD Marin games.  You can look at the scores in these games for proof that their was a definite change from these team’s normal results.

Player passing and guest play, that's part of it. But, a full team roster swap is pretty cheap.
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Post by nTxsoccRfan on 30/05/19, 09:01 pm

Bringing unicorn players for the QT to get into D1 does not seem fair. So, again, I’m glad teams are not allowed to do so. BUT, if a team has injuries (like a GK being out because of a broken wrist) or players being on vacation, I don’t have a problem with guest players. Life happens.

I respect Samba because it is a great team, but you cannot say that your players don’t help Salsa because your keeper (Samba’s) was Salsa’s keeper for a good portion of the JGAL games in the fall. She was also their keeper for the San Antonio Premier Cup. Salsa won this tournament, right? Also, last summer the old Samba team had one of Voutier’s main strikers as a guest player in one the tournaments. I believe you faced Angelone in the finals, but Angelone ended up winning the tournament.

Bottom line is, all teams have lent and/or used guest players for one reason or another. So, don’t keep saying that your players don’t help your sister team or that you never use guest players when we know that this has not always been the case.
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Post by KeepersBeCrazy on 30/05/19, 09:15 pm

The Samba/Salsa keeper situation is true. Samba keeper played for Salsa until they got a keeper right after San Antonio Cup.
That's the rumor, anyway. Also heard that she's actually a late 08...

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Post by Cerv1973 on 30/05/19, 09:33 pm

Nothing to see here, move along.

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Post by melashbrew on 30/05/19, 09:58 pm

Proph, maybe so. I only remember using a guest goalie when my daughter was on the Evans team and that was because our goalie had a broken wrist, then broken jaw, then rightfully decided she no longer wanted to be a goalie. We used 2 Covey/Grado players another tournament b/c we were supposed to have several players out last summer and it was 100 degrees. Not really sure what happened there, but after we had secured guests our regular players were available. Other than our goalie situation and the one tournament where we had some scheduling miscommunication, I do not recall guest players. I could be wrong though... and I don’t know who your are or who your daughter is to help jog my memory. Lol

I’m not personally a fan of guesting unless there is a legitimate need. I understand others feel differently and that’s fine too. It’s within the rules, so it is what it is. Not pointing fingers at any one team. Just stating my opinion.

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Post by ProphAC on 30/05/19, 10:01 pm

It’s cool. I think my daughter guested before you were on the team but Evans had a massive bench and still invited guest players. It was awkward for the guest players, honestly.
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