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Post by SantaFe 20/08/13, 12:45 am

1. Where do you find good private soccer coaches, and how much should you expect to pay per hour?

2. How many competitive girls leagues (11-17) are there in DFW? LHGCL, PPL, Arlington. Who else?

3. If your daughter is pretty good all around (fwd, mid, def) at what age should she start sticking to (or focusing on) one position (or should she do that at all)?

4. When you are talking smaller NCAA schools (Div II), do they generally provide full-ride scholarships for girl soccer players?

5. What physical characteristic (or combination of characteristics) do you think is the most important that sets apart great players from good ones (Leaving out mental/personality)? For example speed, quickness, foot skills, strength, touch, vision, endurance, .....

THANKS!

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Post by ekkeeper1 20/08/13, 01:31 am

To answer your questions about NCAA Division II Schools very few DII schools give full rides solely on soccer. They may combine academics and athletic scholarships and come close. I played division II college soccer and I did not know of any player on our team that had 100 percent athletic scholarship. We had international players and they usually had on campus jobs to compliment there athletic scholarships. Some coaches might give a full ride but very rare that that level. The money seems to be more evenly distributed. If they got a special enough player perhaps they would. I was on an athletic and academic scholarship

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Post by Guest 20/08/13, 06:20 am

5. First Touch, vision, speed of play.

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Post by FriscoSoccer2004 20/08/13, 06:49 am

5. To add, how quickly they can settle any ball down to their feet
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Post by Guest 20/08/13, 08:48 am

I think #5 depends quite a bit on the coach's style and what they're looking for in a player at particular positions. Some coaches rate vision, touch, technique etc.  Others want speed first and foremost.

Also I'm starting to wonder whether "speed of play" is overrated in NTX soccer. It's definitely a big factor used by coaches, but maybe we're self selecting for kids with the super high, frenetic, running around like headless chickens mentality by emphasizing speed of play at such early ages.  Everyone is in a massive rush, and any kid who isn't sticks out like a sore thumb and is likely to be relegated to lower quality teams.

That's one of the key differences I saw with top teams in socal @ surf cup earlier this month. Athletically they were not ahead of us. If anything I'd say we have superior athleticism compared to their top teams (at least in '01 age group).

But tactically, several teams I watched were head and shoulders over NTX teams. So many of their players, especially attacking players, were very,very patient. Even in their attacking third I saw extremely fast and dynamic players holding up the ball, looking for combinations, shielding (not just on the sideline, but out in the middle of the pitch). Even when they had space they didn't ALWAYS take off sprinting to goal with ball if they didn't have support.  Several teams had attacking players comfortable playing with back to goal. Several teams the whole squad played game with head up on the ball. In NTX you'll only see a handful of players can do it on any given team until you get to much older age groups.

This patience and ability to make good decisions should be rated just as highly as speed of play IMO. If you get enough of those type of players on the field, a team's style of play can morph from the warp speed battle royales we have in NTX towards something resembling more what it needs to be when you can't sub 10 times a game.

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Post by Guest 20/08/13, 09:13 am

I think you nailed it man. Speed of play is essential, but patience and understanding is vital. The wild crazy ones wreck havoc on those showing patience at the younger ages.

Watch any higher level games and you dont see them on dead sprints for a full 90.

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Post by JustaSport 20/08/13, 09:27 am

SantaFe wrote:1.  Where do you find good private soccer coaches, and how much should you expect to pay per hour?  

2.   How many competitive girls leagues (11-17) are there in DFW?  LHGCL, PPL, Arlington.  Who else?

3.   If your daughter is pretty good all around (fwd, mid, def) at what age should she  start sticking to (or focusing on) one position (or should she do that at all)?

4.  When you are talking smaller NCAA schools (Div II), do they generally provide full-ride scholarships for girl soccer players?

5.  What physical characteristic (or combination of characteristics) do you think is the most important that sets apart great players from good ones  (Leaving out mental/personality)?  For example speed, quickness, foot skills, strength, touch, vision, endurance, .....  

THANKS!
1. Private skills trainers advertise on this forum regularly. Check with your daughter's coach or other parents you trust for references. $30 - $50 per hour seems to be the going rate, although some are higher.

2. You left out ECNL. I would guestimate 500+ teams in the entire North Texas club group that does not include academy age.

3. You're touching on one of the biggest training mistakes in select sports - in my opinion: positional specialization. More often than not, a coach puts a player where he needs her at all times, and it's usually the exact same spot on the field. Yet the best players have been trained to play anywhere and become strong defensively and offensively as a result. College coaches will often ask a player "what position do you play?" What's the best answer? "Anywhere you need me, coach".

4. No. Full-ride college scholarships in soccer are as rare as winning the Peruvian Mobile Lottery (threw that one in there just for the Brent Coralli supporters).

5. Great players have the complete package. But I would still put speed and the ability to possess the ball high on the list.
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Post by OrangeBlooded 20/08/13, 09:31 am

4-3-3 wrote:I think #5 depends quite a bit on the coach's style and what they're looking for in a player at particular positions. Some coaches rate vision, touch, technique etc.  Others want speed first and foremost.

Also I'm starting to wonder whether "speed of play" is overrated in NTX soccer. It's definitely a big factor used by coaches, but maybe we're self selecting for kids with the super high, frenetic, running around like headless chickens mentality by emphasizing speed of play at such early ages.  Everyone is in a massive rush, and any kid who isn't sticks out like a sore thumb and is likely to be relegated to lower quality teams.

That's one of the key differences I saw with top teams in socal @ surf cup earlier this month. Athletically they were not ahead of us. If anything I'd say we have superior athleticism compared to their top teams (at least in '01 age group).

But tactically, several teams I watched were head and shoulders over NTX teams. So many of their players, especially attacking players, were very,very patient. Even in their attacking third I saw extremely fast and dynamic players holding up the ball, looking for combinations, shielding (not just on the sideline, but out in the middle of the pitch). Even when they had space they didn't ALWAYS take off sprinting to goal with ball if they didn't have support.  Several teams had attacking players comfortable playing with back to goal. Several teams the whole squad played game with head up on the ball. In NTX you'll only see a handful of players can do it on any given team until you get to much older age groups.

This patience and ability to make good decisions should be rated just as highly as speed of play IMO. If you get enough of those type of players on the field, a team's style of play can morph from the warp speed battle royales we have in NTX towards something resembling more what it needs to be when you can't sub 10 times a game.
Personally, whenever a coach has referred to "speed of play", this is how I've defined / interpreted it . . . not so much the ability to move quickly on the field or get to the ball faster then others, but a players ability to (1) quickly make effective decisions and (2) quickly AND accurately act on those decisions.  And that includes knowing when to be patient / hold up play to allow time for other teammates to get in position to be involved. Similar I think to what you're referring to.  

While athleticism is required to be a sound soccer player, more times then not it seems the best player on the field is not the most athletic player involved, but the one that is most technically sound and tactically aware.  It's all about making the best decision, while being in the right space at the right time, with the ability to execute that decision - and that gives them the appearance of "playing faster" then others.

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Post by Flatback4 20/08/13, 10:26 am

In regard to question #4, NCAA division II schools are allowed to give a maximum of 9.9 full athletic scholarship equivalents for a women's soccer team (split amongst the players) so there are very few 100% athletic scholarships at a NCAA division II school when one considers most rosters are typically over 18 players.  I believe NCAA Division I schools are allowed to give a maximum of 12 full athletic equivalent scholarships.  Purely for example, based on a roster size of 20 (for a D2 school) and 24 players (for a D1 school), the average athletic scholarship would be 50% provided the school chooses to use the maximum number of full equivalent athletic scholarships available to it.  Athletic scholarships can be combined with academic scholarships to get closer to the elusive 100% scholarship.  So to get a 100% scholarship you must be THE exceptional soccer player on the team or a very intelligent, exceptional soccer player who can qualify for at least a partial academic scholarship.

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Post by Guest 20/08/13, 10:33 am

I agree with some of that orange...but I'm definitely not talking about speed of play in terms of athleticism. I hate to get too into the weeds (ok ...maybe I don't hate it), but I agree that speed of play is how quickly a player acts out decisions on and off the ball.  "Effective" is relative to how the coach wants to play. Say a kid one touches every ball. One coach might see that as effective, another coach may see it as waste. But the thing they have in common is they all want the kid to play fast, whatever those decisions might be. Just do something and do it pronto.

Where we differ is I think in NTX the kid who acts quickly on decisions is preferred over a kid who takes their time on the ball and is comfortable being patient.

Say a kid has the ball, maybe has a little pressure, but they're comfortable with the pressure.  They don't take off dribbling, or send it. They just hold it, and take a second to survey the field. That kid will hear all manner of hemming and hawing from the sideline. Especially if its anything U11 or under.  

FAST, FAST, FAST,FAST...everything has to be fast.  Slowing the game down is seen as a deficit in a young player's ability. If that kid doesn't learn how to NOT be patient, the kid won't make it at the top of most NTX soccer teams. Of course there are exceptions, but talking about norms here.

Pirlo, yaya or xavi in his prime, all play fast when they need to, but more often they manage the pace of the game.  They don't typically look like they're playing faster than everyone else (to me at least). They look fluid, but rarely frantic. Every so often they'll do something brilliant that makes you realize they're thinking faster than everyone else.

I think it's worth separating "speed of thought" from "speed of play".  You want players who think fast always, but can play fast, slow or anywhere in between depending on what the situation requires. Maybe we're saying the same thing here, but I see the thinking and the acting as two different things.

From most the local games I watch, there is only one play speed  - FULL, and the players who are best able to sustain that bras to the wall, hyper-intense, full out speed of play are the ones that make it on the top teams.  Just wonder does it come at the expense of soccer IQ in the long run.

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Post by Skip 20/08/13, 12:11 pm

Just want to acknowledge one of the most interesting and beneficial threads I've seen on these boards in a while. Thanks for a worthwhile read!

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Post by InaB 20/08/13, 12:16 pm

I have to agree with Orange. A player's ability to quickly scope out situations and then react to the open possibilities is the best all around player. Speed is good, but not if you are just aimlessly running with no plan in mind. I think slowing the game down is probably the hardest thing to learn on the field. As a player, you have to know when to switch speed (even the goalie) to throw the opponent's game off.  

As to athleticism, there is one area that makes or breaks any player and that is endurance. No player can go full out sprinting an entire game as was said in this string. However, the best player is one who can still sprint in the last ten minutes of the game when needed.

I think physical endurance, technical/tactical savvy,  are the best traits, secondarily would be skills and position knowledge. I really think every young player should have an opportunity to learn all positions. A great utility player is the best player to have. One who can play forward one minute and defender the next - depending on the opponent. After all, who can catch a fast forward better than another fast forward on defense? cheers
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Post by dadof3 20/08/13, 12:25 pm

4-3-3 wrote:I agree with some of that orange...but I'm definitely not talking about speed of play in terms of athleticism. I hate to get too into the weeds (ok ...maybe I don't hate it), but I agree that speed of play is how quickly a player acts out decisions on and off the ball.  "Effective" is relative to how the coach wants to play. Say a kid one touches every ball. One coach might see that as effective, another coach may see it as waste. But the thing they have in common is they all want the kid to play fast, whatever those decisions might be. Just do something and do it pronto.

Where we differ is I think in NTX the kid who acts quickly on decisions is preferred over a kid who takes their time on the ball and is comfortable being patient.

Say a kid has the ball, maybe has a little pressure, but they're comfortable with the pressure.  They don't take off dribbling, or send it. They just hold it, and take a second to survey the field. That kid will hear all manner of hemming and hawing from the sideline. Especially if its anything U11 or under.  

FAST, FAST, FAST,FAST...everything has to be fast.  Slowing the game down is seen as a deficit in a young player's ability. If that kid doesn't learn how to NOT be patient, the kid won't make it at the top of most NTX soccer teams. Of course there are exceptions, but talking about norms here.

Pirlo, yaya or xavi in his prime, all play fast when they need to, but more often they manage the pace of the game. They don't typically look like they're playing faster than everyone else (to me at least). They look fluid, but rarely frantic. Every so often they'll do something brilliant that makes you realize they're thinking faster than everyone else.
I think it's worth separating "speed of thought" from "speed of play".  You want players who think fast always, but can play fast, slow or anywhere in between depending on what the situation requires. Maybe we're saying the same thing here, but I see the thinking and the acting as two different things.

From most the local games I watch, there is only one play speed  - FULL, and the players who are best able to sustain that bras to the wall, hyper-intense, full out speed of play are the ones that make it on the top teams.  Just wonder does it come at the expense of soccer IQ in the long run.
I just started reading this, and I think you explained the importance of this aspect...if you think of a great center midfielder or a point guard leading an offense, she will sometimes push the ball fast, sometimes slow depending on what she reads...but here is the individual speed issue...that point guard may not be faster than anyone else, but if she can put the defense in a bad spot (to either allow him to pass and create/shoot or draw a foul) then she can make everyone around her to become an option, that is a special player...likewise, not getting "caught" defensively that way is what makes a special defender.

I also agree, this is a good thread.
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Post by SantaFe 20/08/13, 12:32 pm

thanks for the input above.   That affirms a lot of what I was thinking myself re my daughter- I'm not a soccer player myself, but she seems to have it all (what parent doesnt think that, I guess...) and I want to make sure she receives the training appropriate for her.

Re the ECNL, which teams participate in that?  Is that only certain soccer clubs?  Is this the one that travels and is sponsored by MLS?   How do girls get selected to that- just being discovered and invited?  tryouts?  is that 14yrs up?  sorry for all the Q's, I'll also do more research myself but appreciate the head-start.

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Post by Lefty 20/08/13, 12:36 pm

SantaFe wrote:1.  Where do you find good private soccer coaches, and how much should you expect to pay per hour?  

2.   How many competitive girls leagues (11-17) are there in DFW?  LHGCL, PPL, Arlington.  Who else?

3.   If your daughter is pretty good all around (fwd, mid, def) at what age should she  start sticking to (or focusing on) one position (or should she do that at all)?

4.  When you are talking smaller NCAA schools (Div II), do they generally provide full-ride scholarships for girl soccer players?

5.  What physical characteristic (or combination of characteristics) do you think is the most important that sets apart great players from good ones  (Leaving out mental/personality)?  For example speed, quickness, foot skills, strength, touch, vision, endurance, .....  

THANKS!
Interesting that most of the critical characteristics that are now being discussed in the thread relate more to the mental side of the game and mental speed of thought and play.  i.e can you recognize a situation, do you know what to do in the situation, can you make the right decisions in time, do you know how to be effective in a game as part of the team?

Of course you still have to be able to execute on what you recognize.

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Post by Mia Hamster 20/08/13, 01:33 pm

SantaFe wrote:1.  Where do you find good private soccer coaches, and how much should you expect to pay per hour?  

Asks parents of some 'high level' players in your club.  Good private coaching will be $40 to $60 per hour

2.   How many competitive girls leagues (11-17) are there in DFW?  LHGCL, PPL, Arlington.  Who else?

Throw in ECNL and ODP (sort of a league, but not really)

3.   If your daughter is pretty good all around (fwd, mid, def) at what age should she  start sticking to (or focusing on) one position (or should she do that at all)?

Never.  Play where she adds value to the team.  Players with multiple skill sets are highly valued by all coaches.  Hope Solo played very successfully at forward till college where she switched to keeper.

4.  When you are talking smaller NCAA schools (Div II), do they generally provide full-ride scholarships for girl soccer players?

Full ride is a rare bird at all levels.  Women's Soccer is not a "high dollar" sports draw for any college, thus scholarship money is less available than say men's football, baseball, or women's basketball.

5.  What physical characteristic (or combination of characteristics) do you think is the most important that sets apart great players from good ones  (Leaving out mental/personality)?  For example speed, quickness, foot skills, strength, touch, vision, endurance, .....  

Soccer IQ, first touch, and speed of play

THANKS!
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Post by soliloquy 20/08/13, 02:15 pm

SantaFe wrote:
Re the ECNL, which teams participate in that?  Is that only certain soccer clubs?  Is this the one that travels and is sponsored by MLS?   How do girls get selected to that- just being discovered and invited?  tryouts?  is that 14yrs up?  sorry for all the Q's, I'll also do more research myself but appreciate the head-start.
ECNL is a national league for girls, the competing teams coming from certain clubs across the nation. In NTX, Sting, Dallas Texans, FC Dallas, D'feeters, and Solar compete in ECNL. You do have to travel, and normally getting on an ECNL team is just like getting on a select team. You try out and go to open practices with the team. Normally the top team in each age group of the ECNL clubs becomes the team that will be competing in ECNL once they're in U14.

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Post by Tiki-taka 20/08/13, 02:35 pm

Lefty wrote:
SantaFe wrote:1.  Where do you find good private soccer coaches, and how much should you expect to pay per hour?  

2.   How many competitive girls leagues (11-17) are there in DFW?  LHGCL, PPL, Arlington.  Who else?

3.   If your daughter is pretty good all around (fwd, mid, def) at what age should she  start sticking to (or focusing on) one position (or should she do that at all)?

4.  When you are talking smaller NCAA schools (Div II), do they generally provide full-ride scholarships for girl soccer players?

5.  What physical characteristic (or combination of characteristics) do you think is the most important that sets apart great players from good ones  (Leaving out mental/personality)?  For example speed, quickness, foot skills, strength, touch, vision, endurance, .....  

THANKS!
Interesting that most of the critical characteristics that are now being discussed in the thread relate more to the mental side of the game and mental speed of thought and play.  i.e can you recognize a situation, do you know what to do in the situation, can you make the right decisions in time, do you know how to be effective in a game as part of the team?

Of course you still have to be able to execute on what you recognize.
Thus the importance of the first touch. If a player can't control and possess the ball on the first touch then all the thinking in the world and planning can't be executed properly.
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Post by 03soccerdad 20/08/13, 02:48 pm

First Touch, good judgement, fast decision, skill to put decision into action, reassessment and correction.

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