Guest Player Releases

Hi All-

So my child had an opportunity to guest play in a recent tournament. The NTSSA form requires signatures from the releasing coach, the receiving coach, the parent and the player.

The releasing coach was ok with it and in fact encourage it as it provide more "touches." We love the team/coach we are currently on, but thought this was a great opportunity to play more.

HOWEVER, when asked to actually sign the guest player request, the releasing coach said he could not because the club "board" wouldn't authorize it.

So I am curious if other people have experience with this, good or bad. The attitudes of other clubs. It seems that if the NTSSA form had meant this to pass club approval, they would've had something there to indicate the club also approved.

Thanks for your input.

Every coach is wired different when it comes to this. From their perspective, it appears that you aren't happy/satisfied with what they are doing, and worry about losing you & the possible impact that could have on the club good or bad depending on your DD's abilities. My DD got a release to guest play recently, but coach was not thrilled & asked me to not say anything to others on the team, which Was understandable. The best advice I've read around this issue is to remember at the end of the day, you are paying $2500-3500 to these clubs; they work for you, and you are well within your rights to do what you think is best for your DD. If you really want the release, go and talk to the DOC & ask why they won't allow this. Would be interested if it really is club policy or your coach not owning up to his lack of support for guesting.

jimbo13 wrote:
The releasing coach was ok with it and in fact encourage it as it provide more "touches." We love the team/coach we are currently on, but thought this was a great opportunity to play more.

HOWEVER, when asked to actually sign the guest player request, the releasing coach said he could not because the club "board" wouldn't authorize it.

I bet if he were the RECEIVING coach then the so called club "board" authorization would have been a non-issue.

Had a similar situation with my DD. Got the whole "if I let you, then I would have to let everyone" speech. To me, its the coaches protecting the cash flow, knowing that they really aren't anything special, and tht another cloach / team / club could give the basic same experience. I'm sure the coaches that do offer a better product have no concerns about kids trying something else, because they know they will be coming back.
And as to the club working for you... re-read the contract. You are paying for the privellage for them to completely determine whats best for your DD, without any input or consideration from you parents until the next summer decision period.

wilatnus wrote:Every coach is wired different when it comes to this. From their perspective, it appears that you aren't happy/satisfied with what they are doing, and worry about losing you & the possible impact that could have on the club good or bad depending on your DD's abilities. My DD got a release to guest play recently, but coach was not thrilled & asked me to not say anything to others on the team, which Was understandable. The best advice I've read around this issue is to remember at the end of the day, you are paying $2500-3500 to these clubs; they work for you, and you are well within your rights to do what you think is best for your DD. If you really want the release, go and talk to the DOC & ask why they won't allow this. Would be interested if it really is club policy or your coach not owning up to his lack of support for guesting.

I want you to think about what you said there and of course there should be some give and take. I'm going to throw these situations at you.
We all want to play in either ECNL or Lake Highlands and we pay to be in their leagues so in your theory they work for us! Really so after I've paid my money I can tell these leagues what we want? I didn't think so!
Taxi Cab drivers pay to work for certain companies. So after the taxi driver pays his/her money they have a right to say "You work for me!" Doesn't work like that now does it.
Most people pay their church money does that mean that the church is working for you? Again you go to that church because you like what they are offering so be very careful with "I pay the clubs money so they work for me!" attitude.
Parents and players are customers and there needs to be some good PR between both the Clubs and the parents otherwise clubs wont exsist but your there because you liked what that organization was offering. The clubs/teams also have a right to not offer you a roster spot the next soccer year, that doesnt sound like "you work for me" when one or both parties can walk away now does it?

I've never understood the refusal to sign a guest release based on fear of losing the player. If a coach/club refused to sign for me, they've already lost me.

[quote="]
I want you to think about what you said there and of course there should be some give and take. I'm going to throw these situations at you.
We all want to play in either ECNL or Lake Highlands and we pay to be in their leagues so in your theory they work for us! Really so after I've paid my money I can tell these leagues what we want? I didn't think so!
Taxi Cab drivers pay to work for certain companies. So after the taxi driver pays his/her money they have a right to say "You work for me!" Doesn't work like that now does it.
Most people pay their church money does that mean that the church is working for you? Again you go to that church because you like what they are offering so be very careful with "I pay the clubs money so they work for me!" attitude.
Parents and players are customers and there needs to be some good PR between both the Clubs and the parents otherwise clubs wont exsist but your there because you liked what that organization was offering. The clubs/teams also have a right to not offer you a roster spot the next soccer year, that doesnt sound like "you work for me" when one or both parties can walk away now does it?
[/quote]

True, although there is a funny dynamic at play that depends on how good & important your DD is within her respective club. If your DD is one of the best players on the team, the club does work for you a lot more than others, but that is a discussion for another post. You can't dictate that you want your DD to play more, or play in LH Div. 1. However, if your DD isn't getting enough playing time, or the coach won't allow you to guest play as the OP noted, because you are paying them, you absolutely have the right to pull your DD out and go someplace else (as long as you get a competitive release before April 1st ). I agree ideally there is a nice give and take between club and player to ultimately work together towards a common goal. Hey, partial agreement on a txsoccer post subject; miracles never cease!

I usually covered this before the season begins, ask the coach if he has a problem w/dd guest playing during the slow time of the season, ask him to sign a few releases and keep them for when you need em.

Triumph FC wrote:

wilatnus wrote:Every coach is wired different when it comes to this. From their perspective, it appears that you aren't happy/satisfied with what they are doing, and worry about losing you & the possible impact that could have on the club good or bad depending on your DD's abilities. My DD got a release to guest play recently, but coach was not thrilled & asked me to not say anything to others on the team, which Was understandable. The best advice I've read around this issue is to remember at the end of the day, you are paying $2500-3500 to these clubs; they work for you, and you are well within your rights to do what you think is best for your DD. If you really want the release, go and talk to the DOC & ask why they won't allow this. Would be interested if it really is club policy or your coach not owning up to his lack of support for guesting.

I want you to think about what you said there and of course there should be some give and take. I'm going to throw these situations at you.
We all want to play in either ECNL or Lake Highlands and we pay to be in their leagues so in your theory they work for us! Really so after I've paid my money I can tell these leagues what we want? I didn't think so!
Taxi Cab drivers pay to work for certain companies. So after the taxi driver pays his/her money they have a right to say "You work for me!" Doesn't work like that now does it.
Most people pay their church money does that mean that the church is working for you? Again you go to that church because you like what they are offering so be very careful with "I pay the clubs money so they work for me!" attitude.
Parents and players are customers and there needs to be some good PR between both the Clubs and the parents otherwise clubs wont exsist but your there because you liked what that organization was offering. The clubs/teams also have a right to not offer you a roster spot the next soccer year, that doesnt sound like "you work for me" when one or both parties can walk away now does it?

The cabby/company relationship is like the coach/club relationship; a contract employee. We, the parents/players, are the cabby's fare. We do provide for his income and tell him what our destination is just as we pay for the coach to get our players to a certain soccer goal- our destination. The church is not selling a service and you do not HAVE to pay at all if you should so choose.

How about when you go to a store. You do not pay the person who works there, the store itself does. If you get treated poorly most people feel " hey I pay your salary and you are giving me crappy service ?" That store either fires those type of employees or goes under.

Bottom line is we do pay their salaries and are the only reason the clubs exist. They do work for us. Your take on it is exactly why so many people get walked all over by some clubs and coaches.

Gunner9 wrote:I've never understood the refusal to sign a guest release based on fear of losing the player. If a coach/club refused to sign for me, they've already lost me.

My sentiments exactly.

my2cents wrote:

Triumph FC wrote:

wilatnus wrote:Every coach is wired different when it comes to this. From their perspective, it appears that you aren't happy/satisfied with what they are doing, and worry about losing you & the possible impact that could have on the club good or bad depending on your DD's abilities. My DD got a release to guest play recently, but coach was not thrilled & asked me to not say anything to others on the team, which Was understandable. The best advice I've read around this issue is to remember at the end of the day, you are paying $2500-3500 to these clubs; they work for you, and you are well within your rights to do what you think is best for your DD. If you really want the release, go and talk to the DOC & ask why they won't allow this. Would be interested if it really is club policy or your coach not owning up to his lack of support for guesting.

I want you to think about what you said there and of course there should be some give and take. I'm going to throw these situations at you.
We all want to play in either ECNL or Lake Highlands and we pay to be in their leagues so in your theory they work for us! Really so after I've paid my money I can tell these leagues what we want? I didn't think so!
Taxi Cab drivers pay to work for certain companies. So after the taxi driver pays his/her money they have a right to say "You work for me!" Doesn't work like that now does it.
Most people pay their church money does that mean that the church is working for you? Again you go to that church because you like what they are offering so be very careful with "I pay the clubs money so they work for me!" attitude.
Parents and players are customers and there needs to be some good PR between both the Clubs and the parents otherwise clubs wont exsist but your there because you liked what that organization was offering. The clubs/teams also have a right to not offer you a roster spot the next soccer year, that doesnt sound like "you work for me" when one or both parties can walk away now does it?

The cabby/company relationship is like the coach/club relationship; a contract employee. We, the parents/players, are the cabby's fare. We do provide for his income and tell him what our destination is just as we pay for the coach to get our players to a certain soccer goal- our destination. The church is not selling a service and you do not HAVE to pay at all if you should so choose.

How about when you go to a store. You do not pay the person who works there, the store itself does. If you get treated poorly most people feel " hey I pay your salary and you are giving me crappy service ?" That store either fires those type of employees or goes under.

Bottom line is we do pay their salaries and are the only reason the clubs exist. They do work for us. Your take on it is exactly why so many people get walked all over by some clubs and coaches.

I agree that the parents money pays the coaches salary and I keep saying this, The parents work for the coach-the coach works for the parents and players. My take was never to say "I'm taking your money and I dont care what you think!" That was never the case. What I was pointing out was the poster who said "we pay the money they work for you" So that gives parents a right to say I pay you and you'll play my daughter 100% and you'll play her as a forward and I want the team playing a 3-4-3, You do as I want because I pay you! Really? Sure some coaches lie and tell you everything you want to hear and then take your money! Its far more like a construction worker, you hire the person to do the job, you dont TELL the contruction worker how to do the job but they are working for you the same as coaches are and at the end of the soccer year you might be extremely happy but the coach cannot stand you or your daughter and cuts you from the team even though you offered to pay for next year. They still working for you? I guess not but the team will exist without you.
Bottom line both parties need to be happy and if they are its not an issue now is it?

My frustration is the coach approval versus the club board approval. I'm tending to lean towards tpitty and gunner9.

what club are we talking about? The coach may be hiding behind his 'club', he may really not want you to guest play. On another note I've seen kids guest play on a team without a release, and it being brought to the club/lh attention and nothing coming of it....

What percentage of kids that request a guest player release end up returning to their team? More or less than 50%?

If your coach says "No" to a guest player release, will you definitely leave the team? Or would you still consider staying?

If a coach says "Yes" to a guest player release, weren't you already looking for a new team? If he says yes, would you consider staying instead?

Agreed, most coaches don't like it, but if there is a level of trust there, you should be able to do that...mine has guested a few times. Not something coach relishes, but something that he accepts. We were honest that we weren't going anywhere (and we weren't). Also helps to do it at a time when it isn't "hunting" season for coaches...as if that ever ends-lol.

Never heard that the club had any part in the decision unless it is something preordained (in the contract)...in that case why would the coach start with "it sounds good" and then go back on it...seems a little fishy to me. Sounds like the coach started to question that two-way commitment.

bigtex75081 wrote: What percentage of kids that request a guest player release end up returning to their team? More or less than 50%?

If your coach says "No" to a guest player release, will you definitely leave the team? Or would you still consider staying?

If a coach says "Yes" to a guest player release, weren't you already looking for a new team? If he says yes, would you consider staying instead?

1. No idea
2. Yes. Youth soccer is not indentured servitude.
3. Not necessarily. DD's have friends from other teams, HS teams, ODP, etc.
they'd like to play with. Doesn't mean they're looking to leave.

My DD has guest played several times and I have never heard of the club board not giving permission. I think the coach was not being honest with you and had changed his mind and made that excuse up.